January 31, 2023, at 4:00 PM

Original link

1.   Disclosures of Pecuniary Interest

That it BE NOTED that no pecuniary interests were disclosed.

2.   Consent

Moved by C. Rahman

Seconded by D. Ferreira

That Items 2.1 to 2.9 BE APPROVED.

Motion Passed (5 to 0)

2.1   1st Report of the Accessibility Community Advisory Committee

2023-01-12 ACAC - Report

Moved by C. Rahman

Seconded by D. Ferreira

That the 1st Report of the Accessibility Community Advisory Committee, from its meeting held on January 12, 2023, BE RECEIVED.

Motion Passed

2.2   Next Generation 9-1-1 Authority Service Agreement with Bell Canada

2023-01-31 SR - Next Generation 9-1-1 Authority Service Agreement with Bell - Full

Moved by C. Rahman

Seconded by D. Ferreira

That, on the recommendation of the City Manager, the following actions be taken with respect to the staff report, dated January 31, 2023, related to  the Next Generation 9-1-1 Authority Service Agreement with Bell Canada:

a)    the proposed by-law, as appended to the above-noted staff report, BE INTRODUCED at the Municipal Council meeting to be held on February 14, 2023 to:

i)    approve the Next Generation 9-1-1 Authority Service Agreement between The Corporation of the City of London and Bell Canada; and, 

ii)    authorize the Mayor and the City Clerk to execute the above-noted Agreement;

b)    the above-noted staff report BE RECEIVED; and,

c)    the Civic Administration BE AUTHORIZED to undertake all the administrative acts that are necessary in connection with part a) above. (2023-S11/P16)

Motion Passed

2.3   Building Safer Communities Fund (BSCF) Contribution Agreement

2023-01-31 SR - Building Safer Communities Fund (BSCF) Contribution Agreement - Full

Moved by C. Rahman

Seconded by D. Ferreira

That, on the recommendation of the Deputy City Manager, Neighbourhood and Community-Wide Services, the proposed by-law, as appended to the staff report dated January 31, 2023, BE INTRODUCED at the Municipal Council meeting on February 14, 2023, to:

a)     approve the Building Safer Communities Fund (BSCF) Contribution Agreement, as appended to the above-noted by-law, between His Majesty the King in Right of Canada as represented by the Minister of Public Safety and Emergency Preparedness and The Corporation of the City of London;

b)     delegate authority to the Deputy City Manager, Neighbourhood and Community-Wide Services to execute the above-noted Agreement; and,

c)     delegate authority to the Deputy City Manager, Neighbourhood and Community-Wide Services, or written designate to undertake all the administrative, financial and reporting acts that are necessary in connection with the above-noted Agreement. (2023-P03)

Motion Passed

2.4   Parks and Recreation Master Plan Annual Report

2023-01-31 SR - Parks and Recreation Master Plan Annual Report

Moved by C. Rahman

Seconded by D. Ferreira

That, on the recommendation of the Deputy City Manager, Neighbourhood and Community-Wide Services and the Deputy City Manager, Environment and Infrastructure, the staff report, dated January 31, 2023, related to the Parks and Recreation Master Plan Annual Report, BE RECEIVED; it being noted that the communication, as appended to the Added Agenda, from A. McGuigan, with respect to this matter, was received. (2023-R04)

Motion Passed

2.5   Permanent City of London Indigenous Artwork Collection Source of Financing

2023-01-31 SR - Permanent City of London Indigenous Artwork Collection Source of Financing - Full

Moved by C. Rahman

Seconded by D. Ferreira

That, on the recommendation of the Deputy City Manager, Neighbourhood and Community-Wide Services, the following actions be taken with respect to the staff report dated January 31, 2023, related to the Permanent City of London Indigenous Artwork Collection Source of Financing:

a)    the Culture Services Division, Neighbourhood and Community-Wide Services BE AUTHORIZED to acquire and display a permanent City of London Indigenous Artwork Collection through the London Arts Council Purchase of Service Agreement as part of the City of London Public Art and Monument Policy and Program;

b)    the funding for the above-noted procurement BE APPROVED as set out in the Sources of Financing Report, as appended to the above-noted staff report; and,

c)    the Civic Administration BE AUTHORIZED to undertake all actions necessary to implement these recommendations. (2023-R08)

Motion Passed

2.6   London Fire Department Single Source Call Handling Software

2023-01-31 SR - London Fire Department Single Source Call Handling Software - Full

Moved by C. Rahman

Seconded by D. Ferreira

That, on the recommendation of the Deputy City Manager, Neighbourhood and Community-Wide Services, the following actions be taken with respect to the staff report dated January 31, 2023, related to the London Fire Department Single Source Call Handling Software:

a)    in accordance with Section 14.4(g) of the Procurement of Goods and Services Policy, Fire Administration BE AUTHORIZED to enter into negotiations with Solacom Technologies Inc., 80 Rue Jean-Proulx, Gatineau, Quebec, J8Z 1W1, for pricing for a single source contract for five (5) years for the provision of Next Generation 9-1-1 - compatible call handling software to the London Fire Department;

b)    the above-noted approval BE CONDITIONAL upon The Corporation of the City of London negotiating satisfactory prices, terms, conditions, and entering into a contract with Solacom Technologies Inc. to provide Next Generation 9-1-1 -compatible call handling software to the London Fire Department;

c)    the Civic Administration BE AUTHORIZED to undertake all the administrative acts that are necessary in connection with the authorization above; and,

d)    the funding for the above-noted procurement BE APPROVED as set out in the Source of Financing Report, as appended to the above-noted staff report. (2023-A03)

Motion Passed

2.7   London Fire Department Single Source for Battery Operated Extrication Equipment - SS-2023-008

2023-01-31 SR - London Fire Single Source for Battery Operated Extrication Equipment - SS-2023-008 - Full

Moved by C. Rahman

Seconded by D. Ferreira

That, on the recommendation of the Deputy City Manager, Neighbourhood and Community-Wide Services, the following actions be taken with respect to the staff report dated January 31, 2023, related to the London Fire Department Single Source for Battery Operated Extrication Equipment (SS-2023-008):

a)    in accordance with Section 14.4(d) of the Procurement of Goods and Services Policy, Fire Administration BE AUTHORIZED to enter into negotiations with Darch Fire Inc., 9-402 Harmony Road, Ayr, Ontario, N0B 1E0, for pricing for a single source contract for two (2) years with three (3) option years for the provision of Holmatro battery operated extrication equipment to the London Fire Department;

b)    the above-noted approval BE CONDITIONAL upon The Corporation of the City of London negotiating satisfactory prices, terms, conditions, and entering into a contract with Darch Fire Inc. to the London Fire Department;

c)    the Civic Administration BE AUTHORIZED to undertake all the administrative acts that are necessary in connection with the above-noted authorization; and,

d)    the funding for this procurement BE APPROVED as set out in the Source of Financing Report, as appended to the above-noted staff report. (2023-V07)

Motion Passed

2.8   London Fire Department Single Source Stabilization Rescue Struts - SS-2023-009

2023-01-31 SR - London Fire Department Single Source Stabilization Rescue Struts - SS-2023-009 - Full

Moved by C. Rahman

Seconded by D. Ferreira

That, on the recommendation of the Deputy City Manager, Neighbourhood and Community-Wide Services, the following actions be taken with respect to the staff report dated January 31, 2023, related to the London Fire Department Single Source Stabilization Rescue Struts (SS-2023-009):

a)    in accordance with Section 14.4(d) of the Procurement of Goods and Services Policy, Fire Administration BE AUTHORIZED to enter into negotiations with A.J. Stone Co. Ltd., 62 Bradwick Drive, Vaughan, Ontario, L4K 1K8, for pricing for a one-time, single source purchase of stabilization rescue struts for the London Fire Department;

b)    the above-noted approval BE CONDITIONAL upon The Corporation of the City of London negotiating satisfactory prices, terms, conditions, and entering into a contract with A.J. Stone Co. Ltd. to the London Fire Department;

c)    the Civic Administration BE AUTHORIZED to undertake all the administrative acts that are necessary in connection with the above-noted authorization; and,

d)    the funding for this procurement BE APPROVED as set out in the Source of Financing Report, as appended to the above-noted staff report. (2023-V06)

Motion Passed

2.9   Housing Stability Services Purchase of Service Agreement Template

2023-01-31 SR - Housing Stability Services Purchase of Service Agreement Template - Full

Moved by C. Rahman

Seconded by D. Ferreira

That, on the recommendation of the Deputy City Manager, Social and Health Development, the proposed by-law, as appended to the staff report dated January 31, 2023, BE INTRODUCED at the Municipal Council meeting to be held on February 14, 2023, to:

a)    approve the Municipal Purchase of Service Agreement, as appended to the above-noted by-law, as the standard form of agreement with respect to the purchase of homeless prevention and housing stability services by The Corporation of the City of London; and,

b)    delegate authority to the Deputy City Manager, Social and Health Development, or their written designate, to execute and amend Municipal Purchase of Service Agreements with Service Providers, employing the above-noted standard form Agreement that do not require additional funding or are provided for in the City’s current budget and that do not increase the indebtedness or contingent liabilities of The Corporation of the City of London, with no further approval required from Municipal Council. (2023-S11)

Motion Passed

3.   Scheduled Items

None.

4.   Items for Direction

4.1   Exotic Animal Establishments

2023-01-31 SR - Exotic Animal Establishments

Moved by S. Stevenson

Seconded by J. Pribil

That the following actions be taken with respect to the staff report, dated January 31, 2023, related to Exotic Animal Establishments:

a)    the revised attached proposed by-laws, BE REFERRED to a future meeting of the Community and Protective Services Committee for a public participation meeting; and,

b)     the requests for delegation, as appended to the Added Agenda, BE REFERRED to the above-noted public participation meeting;

it being noted that the Community and Protective Services Committee heard a verbal delegation from W. Brown, Chair, Animal Welfare Community Advisory Committee, with respect to this matter;

it being further noted that the communications from the following individuals, as appended to the Added Agenda, were received with respect to this matter:

  •    W. Brown, Chair, Animal Welfare Community Advisory Committee;

  •    A.M. Valastro;

  •    C. Kuijpers;

  •    F. Morrison;

  •    M. Hamers, World Animal Protection;

  •    R. Laidlaw, Zoocheck Inc.;

  •    D. Brooks, Ontario SPCA and Humane Society; and,

  •    S. Thompson. (2023-P14)

Motion Passed (3 to 2)

Additional Votes:

Moved by S. Stevenson

Seconded by J. Pribil

Motion to approve a proposed amendment to By-law PH-3, part a) to read, “a)  up to 35,000 square feet indoors of the property located at 785 Wonderland Road South.

Motion Passed (3 to 2)

Moved by S. Stevenson

Seconded by J. Pribil

Motion to approve a proposed amendment to By-law L.-131-16, under “Regulations” to add, “or the Zoological Association of America.”

Motion Passed (3 to 2)

Moved by C. Rahman

Seconded by D. Ferreira

Motion to hear the delegation from W. Brown, Chair, Animal Welfare Community Advisory Committee, to be heard at this meeting.

Motion Passed (5 to 0)

5.   Deferred Matters/Additional Business

None.

6.   Confidential

Moved by D. Ferreira

Seconded by J. Pribil

That the Community and Protective Services Committee convene, In Closed Session, for the purpose of considering the following:

6.1    Litigation/Potential Litigation/Solicitor-Client Privilege

A matter pertaining to litigation or potential litigation and advice that is subject to solicitor-client privilege, including communications necessary for that purpose and directions and instructions to officers and employees or agents of the municipality, with respect to exotic animals.

Motion Passed (5 to 0)

The Community and Protective Services Committee convened, In Closed Session, from 4:28 PM to 5:24 PM.

7.   Adjournment

The meeting adjourned at 6:46 PM.

Full Transcript

Transcript provided by Lillian Skinner’s London Council Archive. Note: This is an automated speech-to-text transcript and may contain errors. Speaker names are not identified.

View full transcript (2 hours, 6 minutes)

‘cause it’s still got all that stuff in it. Yeah, I’m getting it, I’m getting it. Good afternoon, everyone. This is a third meeting in the Community and Strategic Services Committee.

The city of London is situated on the traditional lands of the Neshnabek, Haudenosaunee, and Labak, and Adawandran. We honor and respect the history, languages, and culture, the diverse, indigenous people who call this territory home. The city of London is currently home to many First Nation, Métis, and Inuit people today. As representatives of the city of the people of the city of London, we are grateful to the opportunity to work and live in this territory.

The city of London is committed to making every effort to provide alternate formats and communication supports for meetings upon request. To make a request specific to this meeting, please contact CPSC@london.ca or 519-661-2489, extension 2425. I do have the members of committee all here in chambers with us today, excluding Mayor Morgan. I’m looking to committee for disclosures of pecanary interest, seeing none on our consent items.

We have 2.1 through to 2.9. I know we have some questions on some of them, but just looking to see if any of them need to be pulled separate for a different vote, seeing nothing, no one wishing to pull anything for a separate vote, looking for a mover and a seconder of consent items 2.1 through to 2.9, moved by Councillor ramen, seconded by Councillor Ferreira. All of items 2.1 through to 2.0 are on the floor, and I will start my speaker’s list with Councillor Plurple. Thank you very much, Chair, and for you to the staff.

I do have a question to 2.3 and 2.4, and on the point of 2.3, if you look at the funding and my question was, we are eligible for over $3 million, and so far for the first two years, we are roughly $329,000. If there is any plan, you know, when we look at the initiatives we would like to have and what we heard from our constituents, that they do need help, we need money, we need to adjust the issues and kind of get the money as fast as we can and kind of as set right under streets, right? And I was wondering what’s the game plan in this perspective, thank you. Ms.

Smith? Thank you, and through the Chair, thank you very much for your question. So the contribution agreement in front of you today is just for the very first installment of $300,000. This will allow us over the next few months to complete a needs assessment with our community members, and then develop a multi-year strategy and sustainability plan.

At that time then, we hope to bring back the plan and the further funding of the $3 million over the next three years to council for a much more detailed contribution agreement with the federal government. So this is step one, to develop what is the plan, what we hope to fund, what the priorities in the community are, so some deep engagement to understand what are the priorities, what are the organizations that will meet those priorities and those outcomes, and then we will bring that plan, along with a revised contribution agreement, outlying how we will spend the $3 million over the next three years. Councilor Pribble? Perfect, so we are on the track to maximize this grant so we can fully use it for our community.

Thank you, and through the Chair, it is our intent to fully expand all the money that we receive from the federal government. Councilor Pribble? Perfect, thank you very much. Okay, next on my speakers list, I have Councilor Raman, but she will require the microphone.

Thank you, and through you, and just to follow up, I, looking at the contribution agreement, I understand the parameters of it, and I guess this is more for comment than a question, but I can’t stress how urgently funds are needed for youth programming. I welcome the opportunity and see this as a good investment in our community, but I do feel like I wish it was more immediate, in a sense, to get those funds into the right hands because organizations are struggling to meet the needs of young people that need programming right now in our community and the more that we can provide that funding and make that accessible. I think it’s great. So within that strategy that you’re looking at in this comprehensive analysis, is there room outside of the scope to look at other youth programming that can be beneficial to the, to our broader community that may not be specific to this funding?

Thank you. Thank you. To staff for a reply? Thank you, and through the Chair, you’re correct.

Our hope is to turn this around in three short months, and I agree with your idea that how do we leverage current programs that are targeting youth that are working in a proactive and preventative measure with respect to guns, gangs, and violence? So we will definitely be open to that. The sooner we can get our needs assessment and a high level plan that the federal government approves, then we will be able to allocate our funding as quickly as possible. A follow up, Councillor?

Thank you. And I’m just wondering how this might interact this scope of the work that we’re entertaining right now with the youth justice and our justice system in general, but just seeing whether and how and what that alignment might look like. As I know, there’s a real need for programming to help with diversion, to help with other strategies, to keep kids on the right path. Thanks.

Thank you, and through the chair, when we go out for our community engagement, we will go out very broadly. We’re working alongside this with our community and safety and community safety wellbeing advisory committee, which we have representation from the school boards, from the police, from justice, from health. So we will use that as a sounding board and a starting point, but we are very open to a fulsome engagement with a number of our stakeholders across the municipality. Looking further questions on comments on items 2.1 through to 2.9, Councillor McAllister, welcome to committee.

Thank you, and through the chair. I did have a question in regards to 2.4 with the Parks and Recreation Master Plan. I just wanted to stress the importance in echoing when I hear from my award of reopening of the Glen Caron Pool, and also the redevelopment of the Silverwoods Arena. I know everyone is closely watching those developments and any information that can be provided is greatly appreciated on that.

And I just also had a question with regards to River Road being a district park where that would fall in terms of the priorities in the 2023 plan, thank you. Thank you, Ms. Smith. Thank you, and through the chair, I’ll respond to Glen Caron, and then I’ll turn it over to Mr.

McGonagall for some more details about Silverwood and Mr. Stafford about River Road Park. So we recognize how important Glen Caron Pool is to the neighborhood and the community, and we’ve been working to try and solve that, the challenges of an aging pool in that neighborhood. We are confident that we are going to hopefully get there this summer.

So we will be bringing a report back, and my goal is March 2023. Hopefully my team is up there and agrees. But we will have hopefully some good news about Glen Caron Pool and be able to update Council and the community on potential opening for this summer. Excellent, I did see some head nodding from your staff, and I’ll go to them for their comment.

Yeah, thank you, and through the chair, as it relates to Silverwood specifically, there is capital funding approved already in the budget. I think it was approved in ‘19, and that is to redevelop the Silverwood’s arena building and the park campus, and there’s an approximate $2.2 million in approved funding to do that work. We had planned to undertake some engagement for that work in 2019 and 2020, and I would say that this is a project that was backed up from the COVID-19 pandemic. But in 2023, we’ll be working really hard to get out and have some conversations with the community about the future of that space specifically.

In the meantime, it has been acting as a dry pad facility since the arena portion was taken out of the inventory. And so it is right now a really busy facility to support those activities, but we are excited to reach out to the community and talk about the future of that location and the needs of that neighborhood moving forward. Thank you. Councilor McAllister, are you satisfied?

Sorry, a little bit of intense build up there, Mr. Stanford. No worries, thanks, and through the chair. The railroad park will just be working on a master plan this year.

It’s being led by the E&I division and I was working with the parks planning team too to come up with what it will look like. There is funding in place to do some pathway connections as a naturalization and would lot management as it exists. And where the rest of the plan goes, we’ll bring back a report to council and to this committee and we’ll establish if there any additional costs to go through the master plan and what that can be and what that 114 acres can look like. So there’ll be lots of engagement and lots of steps along the way but you’ll be hearing from us a couple of times along the way to talk about what that property can be.

Thank you, Councillor. Councillor Pribble is next to my speaker’s list. And if anyone else would like to get on it, please just signal. Thank you, sir, the chair to the staff still on 2.4.

And I had a couple of questions for actually comments. And the first one was by the way, Kudos to the team because I think somebody initiatives that happened during the last year that are listed are really tremendous for our community. So Kudos to all of you. Two questions comments.

If you look at the future or for example, this year, we do have the strategy and strategic, the pyramid as the corporation. And I was wondering, I know we added one more step for next four years, but if it could be reported in debt in terms of the future so we know kind of the various steps and kind of the deadlines, the accountability, kind of taking it further than for this year when you are listing kind of the plans, just kind of the one line. So I was, I think that would help us tremendously. And the other one, especially for some areas, I thought that demographics would help us a lot as well to see.

So we don’t forget about certain programs that we are doing and to separate it by demographics. Because I do know, again, going kind of as things throughout last year, there were a lot of seniors that, for example, felt that we can do kind of better for them. And I’m quite sure the other demographics, everyone will think that we can do better for them. But if we separate it into the demographics, we have the answers right away, and potentially we can also see, is there a room for improvement?

Because we might have eight initiatives that are great, but then when we look at it, they might be all for one group of demographics. So those were the two comments that I had. If you can incorporate the pyramid strategic plan into this reporting and also look into the demographics. Thank you.

Thank you. Wouldn’t staff like to provide verbal feedback to that? Through the chair, thank you very much for the suggestions, Councillor. The Parks and Rec Master Plan is a 10-year document, and you’re right, we lay it out annually, but what I understand you’re saying, it would be helpful if we laid it out over the next, for example, 10 years of the plan.

So you could see similar to the strategic plan lies out for years, you would like to see us lay it out at least for the next four years. So where the projects are over the next four years. Actually, honestly, one year is enough, because I really think that the projection into the second, third, four year, to go into the bottom steps of this pyramid that will be honestly challenging and not as accurate. But if you can always do it, by the end of the year for the following year, it’ll be fantastic.

Thank you. Thank you. Would you like to provide comment as well, Mr. Manon?

Councilor Stevenson is next on my list. Thank you, and through the chair, I have a question on 2.5. And I was wondering, I know it says that the location, so it’s $100,000 on the indigenous art, says the location is gonna depend, but I was just wondering if there are certain locations that you’re looking at, whether how public they would be, Ms. Smith?

Through the chair, and thank you for our question. Our hope is with approximately $100,000, we will get potentially three pieces of art. The, our goal is the artwork will be displayed, probably at our city facilities, our community centers. We will work with the ARAO division.

All good. And the indigenous partners in our community to identify what facilities and what centers would be the best bit for each of the projects, depending on what the type and the size of the artwork is. And hopefully also we would rotate them around, so 100% they will be in public facilities with a lot of traffic. Councillor Stevenson, a follow-up?

Yes, thank you, and through the chair, I noticed that this 100,000 is coming from the Cultural Prosperity Reserve Fund within approximate balance of 1.2 million. Can you just give me, I haven’t asked this question ahead of time, so I apologize, but just wondered, you know, what approximately what we spent in the last four years, or if there’s an anticipated date for using up that fund? Would you also like to know what that reserve fund ideally is kept at? Yes, please.

Okay, I’ll go to staff. I’m not sure if you need a moment to find those numbers. Thank you, and through the chair, I’m gonna defer to Ms. Armistad, who is extremely knowledgeable about our Reserve Fund.

Okay, do you want to just try, it’s giving the mic up in the gallery. Let’s just make sure it’s working before we try this. Okay, please proceed. Hello, through the chair.

This Reserve Fund was a combined reserve from the Cultural Prosperity Reserve Fund and the Public Art and Monument Reserve Fund. So we do have on the dock at a number of potential public art and monument projects, including the Queens Park Public Art and Monument that was originally promised for $250,000 that will come back to you at some point when we’re ready. We were waiting for the RT project to end the parks and rec, the Queens Park Master Plan to be more finalized. But the intent of the fund now that it’s combined is to further the initiatives of the Cultural Prosperity Plan and eventually probably do a new Cultural Prosperity Plan so that we can keep up with everything once the strategic plan is laid out.

And did you know that Reserve Fund currently at 1.2 is at the level that we would normally like to see it held at? Well, we can, we always look for additional sources of financing for public art and monuments, including sometimes it’s built into the capital projects related to community centers for public art. So can we always use more money for public art and monuments, definitely. And furthering Cultural Prosperity and looking at events and activations, et cetera.

And depending on what you would like to accomplish through the strategic plan. Councilor Stevenson. I have a question on another section, but I don’t know if there’s anyone else in the speakers line up. Right now you’re finishing up for us.

All right. My other question is on 2.9, the Housing Stability Services. And I just wondered with that template, were there any adjustments for accountability or do we feel that we’ve got in terms of getting the services that are agreed upon? Aside from, I know they’re open to and audited at any time.

Our spontaneous audit with 48 hours notice is do we feel as though they’re built into that template is an accountability for the specific number of services that they agreed upon? Mr. Dickens. Thank you and through the chair.

Yes, actually this new standard form template has actually introduced a couple of new changes from the previous standard form template. Some of those changes are at the hands or as a result of changes in the funding envelope and funding mechanism and actual new provincial requirements. Not necessarily to tighten up the agreements, but to look for more specific things at the provincial level, but through our own review and working with our own internal legal team, we’ve been able to introduce a number of specific requirements as well, around confidentiality, governance, accountabilities, responsibilities. So we feel like what we’re bringing forward in this new standard form template, this new purchase of service agreement will inherently improve our ability to ensure that the deliverables, the accountabilities, the back office governance structures for all organizations involved in receiving city funding are at the most highest standards.

Absolutely. Okay, thank you for that, it’s good to hear. Councilor Robin. Thank you and through you, just following up on the question that Councilor Stevenson just asked about the indigenous public artwork collection, I noted the timeline of Truth and Reconciliation Day for 2023, I’m just wondering, and I’m just providing for comment, as we are hosting AMO this year, I’m just wondering if there’s any thought or opportunity to provide any pieces of significance to the region for display during our days of showing off our city, but also of furthering our show of commitment to Truth and Reconciliation.

So through the chair, we can definitely take that back, we work with the London Arts Council, so as soon as this is approved through Council, we’ll be able to start that process to identify the artists, and I don’t wanna speed up artists, but I think that’s a really good idea, and we do have some pieces through the city and through tourism London that we do own, so I think we saw those last year on September 30th here at City Hall, so maybe there’s an opportunity to leverage those pieces too. Thank you, welcome, Councilor Troso. One simple question through the chair. What role of any does museum London play in the display of the art here?

Ms. Smith? Through the chair, through the three pieces of art that we will be seeking through this report or in general? Both, but broadly more in general as a policy matter, ‘cause they have a lot of expertise in these areas.

Through the chair, I’m gonna ask my colleague, Ms. Armistead, if she could respond to the relationship we have with Museum London? Through the chair, we have a very close relationship with Museum London, and currently we are in consultation with a conservator that also works kind of in the private sector with Museum London to probably create some of the display cases and help us potentially to locate the public art once we know what it is we have. So we, but we are separate organizations.

So it all depends on, they’re very generous with their time and Museum London also participates on the community juries through the London Arts Council to help lend their expertise. Councilor, was that adequate? Okay, thank you, looking for their questions or comments on items 1 through to 2.9. Seeing as it’s already been moved and second, call on the question.

Closing the vote, the motion carries five to zero. Thank you, that moves along to scheduled items to which I have none, which moves us on to items for direction. We have 4.1 being exotic to animal establishments. It is up to committees purview if you prefer to have any questions answered in camera before this item or vote on this item and then take care of anything for confidential session.

Do we just prefer to do 4.1 first and then deal with Councilor Ferreira? I was just thinking it might be prudent for us to maybe get the input from the city solicitor in camera before we proceed with discussion, but I don’t know how the other committee members would think about that. But I guess I’ll put a motion on the floor and see if someone will second it. Okay, but advise that is in order.

If you wanna have any questions from the solicitor answered in closed session first from committee, sorry, not visiting members. Don’t get a, okay. So Councilor Perbal is seconding in camera first. I’ll leave it to the clerk to get the wording up.

Okay, the vote is open. My system is having a technical error. I’m verbally voting yes. Supposing the vote, the motion carries five to zero.

Thank you. At this time we’re going into confidential session. That’d be 6.1, the litigation, potential litigation. Welcome back and thank you for your patience.

We’re back in items for direction. Item 4.1 is the exotic animal establishments. You’ll notice for committee on the added agenda, there are a number of delegation requests, eight plus. So eight of those.

So two things procedurally that if we do move and accept the by-law, it will trigger a public participation meeting, in which case the public would be invited to speak and register, so my recommendation would be, you can always do as you wish, but at that time the delegates could be received and have their opportunity to speak. Some of the delegates you’ve heard from at the last meeting that we had, they have been advised that there would be a public participation meeting should this pass. I will also note that for the members of the public and committee that whatever we decide here today goes to council on February 14th for a full vote of council, in which case it may or may not pass, as it could be overturned as a committee decision. And if it does passes and there is a by-law introduced that that would come back in March for a public participation meeting, just for we know the timelines of what we’re getting into and what would be ahead of us.

So I am at your discretion of how you like to proceed, of something being put on the floor, or well as well if one committee member has already indicated they might make light to make some changes to the proposed by-law. And once it goes on the floor, we could do amendments as well. Councilor, I’m just dealing with committee members right now and as you’re not on the committee, I’m going to not answer that at this moment. So looking to committee members of how you would like to proceed, if you would like to put something on the floor and Councilor Troso you would need to turn off your mic.

Okay, so it was just a procedural question from members of committee that whatever happens if you move A and B and there is one change in the clerks that it be referred for consideration public participation meeting versus submitted that committee will make its decision today either way. Our full council meeting is on February 14th, which will take whatever recommendation council has, this committee has made and either uphold it or reverse it or potentially do something else. And if it is past the by-laws going to come with a public participation meeting attached to it, that will be hosted at this committee in March. There’s not enough time to do it for the February one with giving the residents notice and invite them back.

So that should clear up the procedural questions of the timing. So looking to committee that realizing that this was a direction that staff didn’t endorse, but this was a council directed report coming back and this is what’s before us tonight, that there is wording on page of the original report of 117. If anyone on committee would like to move that, if not, there could be a motion to receive and take no action or another direction. So looking to committee for what you would like to do.

Committee, not visiting members. Councillor Stevenson. Sorry for clarity and still a clarity question. So the options are to accept this as written.

The options are anything you would like. We could accept it as it’s written. You can put it on the floor and then amend it. Or you could decide to take no action and just receive and file and not make a by-law.

Okay, so I put a motion forward to put it on the floor. Okay, so that would be motion for A and B of the this B. Is your artwork, I’ll just have to clerk read it. That on the recommendation of the deputy city manager planning and economic development, the proposed by-law as appended to the staff report dated January 31st, 2023 be referred to.

Sorry, I’ll try that again. That on the recommendation of the deputy city manager planning and economic development, the proposed by-law as appended to the staff report dated January 31st, 2023 be referred to a future meeting of the community and protective services committee for a public participation meeting. Councillor Stevenson, that is just a clarification on what you’re moving as it was written. Yes.

Would there be a seconder of the committee member for this, Councillor Pribble seconds it, which now would start my speakers list or if someone wanted to do amendments to that motion or anything in the by-law, this is the time. Councillor Stevenson. I had given the clerk two amendments. Do you want me to read them or?

Yes, please, which would give her a chance to do any clarification. So two amendments, one is on page 122 for by-law number PH3 that in section one A where it says 785 Wonderland Road south, that it’s say up to 3,000 square feet indoors in addition to that, the address. Just one moment. We’re just asking one clarification purposes.

There’s no, sorry, we’re just looking for official clerk direction. Councillor, could you read out the second part of your proposed amendment now? Yes, thank you. On page 120, under regulations that it state every holder of an exotic animal establishment shall be a member of an authorized accreditation organization, i.e., CASA.

Thank you, just going to go to staff, having heard these two proposed amendments, if there’s any questions or potential issues with the by-law, should these changes be made? Thank you for those questions and through the chair. With respect to the authorized accreditation, together with advice from our city vet is exactly the reason that we specifically noted the Canadian Association of Zoos and Aquaria, CASA, and the Association of Zoos and Aquariums as a, by just saying, by an authorized agency, that’s quite a broad term. And as staff, we may have a difficulty in identifying what a authorized accreditation agency is.

With respect to the first amendment to page three, I don’t know exactly the square footage of Reptilia, although I’ve toured it, that may have to be amended as such, if the committee wishes to provide a specific square footage. Thank you. Councillor Stevenson, would you still like to make your amendments having heard that or? As far as I know, we’re going to have another chance to amend this again, if the square footage did need to.

I did look at the newspaper article said it was currently 25,000 square feet, or that was planned. The other amendment, does staff have any issue with adding a third organization instead of changing it to more general and adding the Zoological Association of America? To Mr. Catolic, or other staff, not sure if you can comment or having been familiar with the Zoological Association of America.

As through the chair, I am somewhat familiar with that, but I would like to consult with our city vet for advice prior to passing this in the by-law. Thank you. Okay, so you’ve heard the two proposed amendments from Councillor Stevenson. Would you, would you have a seconder?

Would you like me to ask colleagues? Okay, looking to see if there’s a seconder? Seeing none, are you seconding? Actually, I’ll have a question.

Okay. Even though we heard from our staff in terms of the ZAAD Zoological Association of America that our staff would like to discuss is this the veterinarian expert. We could still include it in the by-law because it could be amended afterwards with the square footage anyway. So we could include it in this.

So I’m proposing to add the third organization into the amendment. Okay, so it sounds like you’re seconding the 30,000 square feet and adding in. Councilor Pribble. Oh, sorry.

Okay, this is still potentially a long night ahead of us. I’d prefer not to be here for three hours again. Are you seconding the 30,000 square feet and the Zoological one? Yes.

My comments to commit at this time is, yes, we can do it that way, but as we put things out for public comment and people come prepared for it and then we start revising things as we go. It makes a very convoluted public participation process of what they’re actually commenting on as they come prepared, having researched themselves and then coming in, we say, nevermind. That’s also feedback we get from the public of not being what clear direction we’re taking and it’s also staff time. So that amendment is on the floor.

It’s not yet. Okay, so another click behind the scenes is doing other things. There is a mover and a second or two it though. So I could start a speaker’s list on this.

It’s not in the system yet, sir, Robin. Thank you and through you, just through you. I just had a question related to the square footage part of the amendment. Specifically, I think I know where the counselor is intending to go with putting that into the location.

I’m just wondering perhaps if it’s possible for staff to comment, is there another qualifier that helps to narrow the location, whether it’s within the planning documents that specify that this is for the specific location that can be provided instead of just by way of square footage? Yes, through the chair, thank you for that question. In the bylaws that we reviewed, there are some other examples for strictly names, premises which are exempt, so for example, in the Ottawa bylaw, they name the premises, for example, little raised reptile zoo, life of Riley petting zoo, and those are specifically named in their animal control bylaw as exemptions. So that is another option.

I don’t know if anyone from our legal staff wanted to provide additional advice on this. Thank you, anyone from legal would like to chime in? Sorry, Madam Chair, yes, I’d be pleased to comment. Those types of specifics are appropriate for the bylaw, I have no concern.

Mr. Card, I guess the question is legally, would you prefer a name of the established firstment versus the 30,000 square feet, or is it all the same? Well, the problem with using a name is that it creates issues with transfer, but from the initial standpoint, it really doesn’t make any difference. It provides some specificity as to the location and the proprietor, the problems arise down the road.

I think my preference would be simply to identify the location. Mr. Raman, follow up. Thank you and through you.

So being the location is large, is there a way within either unit number or some other thing that shows up in the planning application that can therefore distinguish the premises as that premises? Yes, thank you for the question through the chair. If a square footage was indicated, and that was similar plus or minus to the square footage of the current built facility, the animal control bylaw has to be read in concert with the proposed and/or submitted business licensing amendment, ‘cause it refers to a licensed facility. Hey, Councillor Ferrera.

Thank you and through you. I do wanna speak on the bylaw and the amendment that’s gonna be a place in front of us. I just wanted to read it first, if I was just wondering if the kid would come up, I could just go over really quick before any comments. Hey, so there are two, if you go to current item and refresh in your eScribe, the clerk might put one at a time up on the screen.

So it’s the proposed amendment bylaw pH three, be amended in part eight or read up to 30,000 square feet on the property located at 783 and the second part is the proposed amendment to bylaw L-131-16, be amended under regulations to add the Zoological Association of America. Just looking to Councillor Stevenson and the wording is correct. I’d just like to update to 35,000. We’ve checked the number.

The second are okay with that change. The seconder’s fine with that change. And yes, it is the same over and seconder for both proposed changes. Okay, Councillor Ferrera, as I said, if you hit current item refresh, it’ll come up.

Are you prepared to speak on this matter? Yes, thank you. So I, what was spoken about that could have been like in closed session, what we got from the solicitor, the city solicitor and everything that has kind of been just kind of put onto the floor. You know, my concerns are with obviously the animal welfare and the lack of municipal expertise and the lack of provincial— Strictly on the amendment at this time.

All right, well, I guess I won’t be supporting this amendment just for everything that was discussed. So I could speak longer to that. I do have reasons for that, but I guess I’ll wait for my chance to do that. Okay, if we’re ready to call the vote on the strictly the amendment before us, strictly committee members of this time.

I’m gonna go with a no and get this amendment taken care of and then we’ll proceed. I would like to say I object to that because as a council member of nobody else wants to speak on the committee on the amendment, I don’t think— - Yeah, sorry, we’re going through the clerk’s look for an official ruling. I’m sorry, I don’t wanna do this, but I really feel as if I have speaking rights here after everyone else is done, so I don’t want to— One moment please, the clerk will make a ruling. I know that you’re challenging the chair.

Well, I feel I should be able to address why I think the amendment— - I understand you’re challenged the chair and the clerk’s gonna go through the procedural bylaws and make an official ruling. But they’ll probably need your mic, Councillor Troso. There was another point of order that I wanted to raise with respect to the delegations and I feel I should be able to at least briefly state that. We haven’t even got to the delegations yet.

Oh, okay, thank you. Ms. Westlake plowers. Thank you through the chair.

Can I first confirm that you can hear me, okay, please? Yes, we can, please proceed. Thank you, thank you. So under section 31.7 of the procedural council procedure bylaw, members who are not members of the standing committee shall speak after the standing committee members have spoken.

So there is a right for all council members to participate in the debate. Thank you. Also note I received a question from the public that the video link did go blank and what happened for the public streaming. That happens when we go into closed session and it resumes again when we come out.

So you did not meet anything in public session and that stream has resumed. Okay, I’ll finish looking to members of committee then for comment before going to any visitor Councillors. Councillor Stevenson. I just noticed that indoors is missing from the amendment as well.

So up to 35,000 square feet indoors at the property. Okay, that’s going to be updated currently in eScribe. Councillor Ferri, did you want to finish commenting on this one? Thank you Madam Chair and through you.

Was I going to say, oh yeah, okay. So the concerns, it’s the animal welfare, the lack of municipal oversight, the lack of provincial oversight and really the health and safety and wellbeing of Londoners. I feel like there’s a lot of inherent risk and there’s a lot of different aspects. If we were to go through with this, that would just put a lot of burden on the city and just speaking on how the conversations are going, it is looking like we just don’t have the capacity to really to meet these levels that we would need to meet.

It would cost us a lot and the financial burden would be pretty large. And what was spoken before, I do see that the amendments of the by-law do speak about the issue with the 785 location and that is all fine. However, I feel like it was said previously, I think the first level of avoiding inherent risk is trying to avoid the situation altogether and just avoiding the risk. So that’s why I’m going to be voting no to the amendment and I will vote no against the by-law if we do get there.

So thank you. Thank you, seeing Councillor Stevenson. Are we talking on the issue in general and just the amendment? The amendment, Councillor Troso.

Yes, I’ll limit my comments to the amendment. I think we have to be very careful. I think we have to be exceptionally careful in terms of how we’re going about drafting what’s going to come before council. This is a very contested measure.

And I feel as if we’re writing important language that should go back to staff for some very careful clarification, we’re writing some language on the fly, both in terms of the additional, both in terms of this additional organization, which we have no information about in front of us. And also in terms of the legal description, the legal description is important. And there is a lease, there is a lease. Every lease is going to have a description of the demise premises in the lease.

So there would be ways for staff to retrieve this. But I think to sit here right now at six o’clock to try to cure a report that needs some more work is very perilous and I would urge people to vote against these amendments. And I’ll leave it at that. Thank you, looking at further questions or comments on the amendment, Councillor Van Merbergen.

Thank you, Chair. I wanted to make a comment about this, well, let’s use the Canadian. ZAA, the Zoological Association of America. From my understanding, what I’ve seen from it, it’s very well regarded.

I just wanted to quickly state some of the accreditations they’ve given out to various organizations, such as the Pittsburgh Zoo, San Antonio Zoo, Monterey Zoo, the Metro Richmond, Virginia Zoo, Columbus Zoo, and it goes on and on. So I just wanted to make that point. So it very much belongs as part of that amendment. This is ZAA.

But then I also heard a little earlier about, and I’ve heard this around this horseshoe now about risk. And if I just wanted to briefly mention that risk is part of being a human being, it’s part of our world, it’s part of our life. And yes, we must try and mitigate it, but we look at ourselves and… Sort of just try to keep it to the amendment of the 30,000 square feet.

Well, it was stated earlier and it was allowed. So we look at… I took the comment as a committee member versus thinking they might’ve went into farther depths of the amendment from a voting member. Well, if I could just finish my thought, we build roads as a municipality and people die on those roads.

We build rec centers and kids are hurt in those rec centers. Yes, we can live in a realm of fear and do nothing. I’m saying, let’s move forward with this. This is well-reasoned and it makes sense.

Thank you, calling the question. Councillor Hopkins. Thank you for recognizing me. I just wanted to follow up.

My colleague here reminded me of and my comments with great respect to the committee. I just wanna make sure we understand what we’re doing here. And I’d like to know a little bit more about the Zoological Association of America and what exactly that means and why this accreditation is being put in. I assume that was a question for staff.

If they have any expertise or know of this place. Okay, Mr. Catolic, if that would be you. Yes, through the chair, at this point, I have limited information about this association, but if it is a direction of council to include this within any bylaw amendments, I will consult with our city vet and come back with a reasoned analysis and a recommendation.

Councillor Hopkins. Yeah, thank you for that information and I would encourage the committee not to support this given what staff has just said. Thank you. Seeing no further questions or comments from committee, calling the question on the amendment.

Okay, just as it was done in the system, it’s going to come up in E-Scribe as two portions. The first portion is for the 30,000 square feet. So 30 as it’s been amended to 35,000 square feet. So if you reflect your refresher screens that should come up correctly.

And is that wording up on the screen? Okay, and the vote is open. Closing the vote, the amendment carries three to two. Thank you.

This amendment is now up for voting, which is under regulations to add the Zoological Association of America. Closing the vote, the amendment carries three to two. Thank you. So for procedural, we’re going to, the amended amendments have went through.

So it’s now the bylaw as amended. Once we decide as a committee, if we’re going to accept the bylaw, at that point, we will then know what we’re doing with our public delegations, of if you want to hear them tonight, or when you know that there’s going to be a public participation meeting, they could be referred to that. So we need to get through first, what we’re doing with the bylaw. So looking for committee members, it would be helpful if there was anyone else thinking of any amendments.

We could take care of those first, if you know about them ahead of time, certainly things come up through conversation. But if anyone else on committee had an amendment to put forward, I’ll just start with that. Seeing none, at this point in time, we can do it as the conversation furthers as required, but starting my speaker’s list to the amended motion. Absolutely.

I do believe that the delegation, whether it’s all of the delegations that you decide to hear, or simply just the added delegation of the Chair of the Animal Welfare Advisory Committee, would be germane and would help inform the committee on this matter. So I would urge you to at least listen to the Chair of the Animal Welfare Community Advisory Committee, whether or not you wanna hear the other delegations, you should hear that one first. ‘Cause I think it goes to some of the very specific questions on the table. Thank you.

I did take my advice from the committee clerk, but we can certainly ask them if they have any different procedural ways to go forward versus what I’ve already been advised of. The Chair, it would be up to the committee how they wish to proceed. Typically advisory committee members, Chair specifically, are given delegation at standing committee rather than requesting delegation. So that’s why it’s listed on the agenda as a delegation, rather than a request for delegation.

If the committee wishes to hear that delegation and refer the remaining to the future public participation meeting, they can do that. However, if they wish to hear from everyone at the same time, they could refer everything to the public participation meeting, or they could just hear all the delegations right now. It’s entirely up to the committee. That’s a ramen.

Thank you and through you. If the committee is so inclined, I’m happy to put forward that we hear the delegation from our Animal Welfare Community Advisory Committee before we decide on this. Thanks. Okay, that’s fine.

Happy to take that direction. Just looking to committee before we have the speaker come forward, are they in chambers or online? Okay, they are on Zoom. That’s been confirmed.

Is there any other considerations for amendments before we have someone speak to it so they could speak informally to the matters before them? Okay, seeing none from committee. Councilor ramen, looking to see if it would be motion put forward from you to hear delegation of the W. Brown, Chair Animal Welfare Community Advisory Committee at this time, and not the others.

Thank you, I’m looking to move that motion. Councilor for a second. Questions or comments? I see none.

Calling the vote. Closing the vote, the motion carries five to zero. Come W. Brown to committee.

You will have five minutes to speak on this item. Your choice, if you wanna welcome. We can see you just fine. Your choice, if you wanna have your camera on or off, that’s up to your pleasure.

And just to let you know, this proposed by-law has been changed just to add in a square footage of 30,000 square feet and another potential regulator as being the Zoological Association of America. That’s the only changes that’s happened so far. So welcome and you have five minutes. Okay, thank you very much.

Okay, so this report addresses new issues raised in the January 31st staff report to the Community Protective Services Committee on Exotic Animal Establishment. Sorry, just one second. From the welfare. Sorry, Ms.

Brown. I don’t know. Committee remains strongly. Sorry, Ms.

Brown. Yes. Just, sorry, don’t, not really. I will restart your time.

Don’t worry about that. Your camera’s glitching a little bit. I don’t wanna know. Perhaps you wanna turn off your visual just to save some broadband width and we can hear you better as just your in and out.

And we would really like to hear what you have to say. Okay, so just bear with me for a minute. Absolutely. I’m gonna pull up my visual on my other device and I’ll close that.

Thank you for letting me know. So just bear with me here. Okay, so please know if you have any glitches again and I’ll try to do my best with this. Okay, this report addresses new issues raised in the January 31st staff report Community and Protective Services Committee.

The Animal Welfare Community Advisory Committee remains strongly opposed to and continues to recommend against granting an exemption to the animal control bylaw, to reptile a zoo, to permit the keeping of the animals at West Mount Mall. In particular, our research has shown that the bites at our local hospitals, we feel strongly that this issue alone is a substantial grounds to maintain the current prohibitions against keeping these animals. And we have identified the following weaknesses in the proposed bylaw before us. The draft amendment is too broadly written.

First, it would exempt all class seven animals, which includes animals such as tigers and other big cats, monkeys and prohibited birds, as well as venomous reptiles. Second, the exemption would apply to the entire proposed designation at 785 Wonderland Road South, not just the interior square footage rented by reptilia zoo. This could impact the residential towers proposed by West Mount and possibly open the door to live animals shows with reptiles or big cats or monkeys and other class seven animals in all parts of the mall and parking lot areas. The requirements of a written public safety plan, insurance and indemnification as a condition for issuance of a license should be in the bylaw rather than designated to the license manager.

We are concerned that there are no prohibitions against the sale of animals. We are also concerned that there is no prohibition against using potentially dangerous class seven animals as part of a mobile educational program or live animal show. Toronto’s municipal code chapter 349 animals has this type of provision to prevent the transport of prohibited animals to birthday parties or schools. The powers of license manager were concerned that there is no requirement that the license manager inspect the location as well as any relevant records at least once per year.

Both the Ottawa and Bon animal control bylaws provide for inspection by city staff. An annual inspection by city staff is necessary because CASA accreditation is reviewed only once every five years and the provincial animal welfare service is primarily complaint driven. Are other concerns anti venom? Toronto and St.

Catherine’s both recently denied similar requests by reptilia to open a zoo in a mall. We previously submitted the Toronto Zoo staff report. That report cited health and safety considerations, particularly the inability of local hospitals to manage anti venoms. This is very worrisome since Toronto is home to the nearest large hospitals where someone bitten by venomous animal could be airlifted.

Public safety, public safety is an animal welfare concern because when incidents occur animals typically pay the price with their lives. The draft bylaw would require an emergency management and public safety plan, but we have concerns about relying on a private corporation that is not accredited by CASA and city staff are police with no experience in handling venomous animals. Toronto city staff were similarly concerned about introducing staff into a regulatory area where they currently do not have a role nor the expertise. Captive bred reptiles are still wild.

They retain the same biological behavioral characteristics as their counterparts in the wild. Even if they have been bred for several generations in captivity, reptiles can experience discomfort, stress, pain, injury and suffering. One can find and simplistic minimal enclosures are when being handled or transported. Toronto city staff were very troubled about past investigations of reptilian zoo by the Provincial Animal Welfare Service and many other animal welfare issues related to private zoos and mobile zoos.

A precedent, roadside and mobile zoos that currently operate outside city limits will likely apply for a license and request a similar exemption from the animal control bylaw. Every mall in London has the potential to become a zoo with reptiles and other animals under the place of entertainment zoning. Toronto city staff were very concerned about an increase in requests for an exemption, especially from mobile live animal programs. The location, we do not believe it is appropriate to permanently house venomous reptiles in a mall.

Reptiles have specific housing needs and should not be indirect sunlight or drafts. Snakes are notorious for crawling into vents and can stay there for weeks. We have questions about how a zoo might impact West Mountain’s proposed plans for residential towers. For instance, Hamilton’s bylaw regulate responsible animal ownership requires the facility housing venomous animals to be accredited by CASDA and beyond a premises where there’s no residential use, share no common areas or walls, any other uses or self-contained and share no end-back system and no plumbing system with any other use.

Societal and ethical concerns are constituents made it clear they did not consider animals for entertainment humane, which is why we do not see animal circuses operating in London any longer. Zoning for zoos was removed in 2011 in response to animal welfare issues related to the private zoo that can be split, for example. Council’s decision to not amend the business licensing bylaw in 2018 is in response to the issue of private zoos and live animal mobile programs in a particular reptilia zoo at the time was a progressive recognition of all concerns related to such uses within the city. 45 seconds.

It is clear that a fulsome informed deliberation on this issue will be hampered by the dearth of important relevant information. For this reason, the public interest, this matter should be referred back to staff for clarification regarding all aspects of anti-venom, including its acquisition, storage, use, London’s available medical expertise, hospital preparedness and reptilia staff competencies. The contents of a public safety plan, including how the plan was formulated and whether it has been reviewed by external experts with relevant knowledge and experience, whether training for city staff will be undertaking in this new regulatory area and more specifically and precise language for any proposed amendments for the animal control and business licensing bylaw. In conclusion, AWAC would like to reiterate in the strongest possible way that the better alternative is to maintain the current animal control bylaw provision for class seven animals and not permit any exemptions.

Denying an exemption would not prevent reptilia zoo from operating with the current permitted animals and any animals they are licensed to keep by the Ontario Ministry of Northern Development, Minds, Natural Resources and Forestry. Thank you. Thank you. You did go over your time, but thank you for being so patient this evening and waiting with us for your opportunity to speak.

For anyone online or following along in the added agenda, it was page 152. Was there written comments submitted with this report as well? If you wish to refer back to it at anything as well, all council members will have access to this part of their informed decision. Looking to continue the speakers list this evening, Councillor Stevenson.

I’ll also, I don’t know I’ll interrupt you before you have a chance to start. The hour is at six o’clock. This was a divided vote vote prior going into this. I’m not sure if anyone’s minds respectfully have been changed from now going into this.

As it was a three, two vote last time and we’ve seen that throughout this evening as well. Not looking to stop the conversation, but just realizing how we went in the past. Realizing is also after six o’clock, not sure if committee wants to stop for a brief break or if you believe that you’re close to wrapping up in your hands of if you want to break or just keep going. A shrug, okay, I see a shrug and I keep going so no one’s giving me the eye yet.

So when you do let me know and Councillor Stevenson, so I don’t know if we can just keep our comments tight as I know my speaker’s list is growing and we can just share this base and go around. Thank you. I just want to give a few comments. I mean, I appreciate how much everyone cares about both the animals and the people.

And reptilia has operated for 26 years with no incidents. Like if that doesn’t alleviate some of the fears, I don’t know what to say. And people who don’t want to go, won’t go. So we’re not imposing anything on anyone.

It’s not going into a public space where people have to go in. They have a choice to go in or not. So this, we’re coming into an economic climate where businesses are suffering and people need jobs. And this offers that and to ignore the economic benefits, I think is a disservice to the majority of Londoners and to have tourism come in, could help our hotels, our restaurants, it gives jobs.

We’ve got young families, families of all ages and grandparents who can take their children here, something for the young people to go to. I really think we need to look at the bigger picture here. And even the city staff report talks about employment, how it fits into the London plan, the economic benefits. So we talked about being bold and risky and innovative in our strategic plan.

And the words are great. And it really matters when it comes to the vote as to whether or not we’re going to walk that out. Thank you. I have councilor Ferrer and then councilor Privel.

And thank you and through you. So we have this by-law amendment on the floor right now that it seems that committee is going to be deciding on. So I just wanted to point some things out. Like on top of the health and safety aspect, on top of the liability and the risk that the city would be undertaking for moving something like this forward, the lack of provincial oversight, which was discussed, the fact that there’s no public safety plan and there’s nothing really written about the possible sale of animals or anything to do with the mobile live shows.

I guess I would just kind of sum it up to this last point and it’s the fact that this by-law is permitting class seven animals to be, it would permit class seven animals to be shown at the space for reptilia. And like, again, like those class seven animals goes far beyond what reptilia is talking about showing, you know, and I would just ask to be just to think about it now in the future if we do open up these floodgates and we have another vendor come through that would like to show off bears who is also a class seven animal or kangaroos or something along those lines. Where does the buck stop? Do we say no to that?

And if we do, then all of a sudden we kind of find ourselves in a discriminatory kind of position where we’ve allowed one organization to show their animals, but we don’t allow another one. So I’m just fearful of that as well. So just, I would, I would really hope that you would consider that as you vote today. So thank you.

Thank you, Councillor Pribble. Mr. Chair, just to address what was just said, I do think we’ll have an opportunity and again, with the staff’s input when it goes to the council to change certain things potentially in terms of, for example, the animal classification. I just want to add on to the success of reptilia and, you know, London, are we, do we consider ourselves less or worse than, for example, like City of Vaughan?

Great success. I had an opportunity to talk to my fellow Councillor and staff at the City of Vaughan. They said it’s a win, win, win, win for the city, win for the residents and win for the business for over 20 years. And if you look at the situation we are in and London has always been a sports destination, potentially corporate convention destination, we’ve never been a leisure destination.

If you look at the hotel business, if you look at certainly right now the issues with one of the hotels attached to the RBC, we are collecting from one hotel between the taxes and accommodation tax close to $1 million. If you look at our strategic plan, which we addressed, started to address last week, we have eight areas of focus. One of them is revenue generating, the other seven are not. This is a perfect fit for the revenue generating.

It’s a piece of the puzzle that can move us forward. We never had, we never had facilities, entertainment, 365 days a year. This is a potential that we can change. Again, if we are turning this down, are we saying, how come out of municipal?

If we were the first one, I’ll be right now, I’ll be very much more cautious, but we are not. And if someone can do it for a quarter of a century, why can’t we, why can’t we? And again, if you look at our areas of focus, and if you look at the other areas, the initiatives that we wanna plan to do, I do think that our priorities are to make enough and to have us to support financially the other areas of focus. And what I’ve been saying kind of before, comparing us to other municipalities, we are London, yes, we can.

And certainly if Canada can do it, why can’t we? And let’s focus on the things that are even more important and we make money for the things that mean even more in our lives or our municipality. When we were door knocking, people of London, they were telling us that it’s not that they don’t appreciate, we are passionate about London, we love Londoners, et cetera. But they said to you what, we prefer if Londoners or you guys, if you get elected, if you deliver the results for us.

And this is delivering results. Yes, we need to protect ourselves as much as we can. That’s why we will have the staff in terms of the rules, regulations, licensing, what it is. We will protect ourselves as much as we can, but we are gonna, hopefully, we will move forward and we will address the issues that our municipality needs the most.

Everyone’s can do it, I believe we can as well. Thank you. Thank you, Councillor Hopkins. Yeah, thank you for allowing me to speak at your committee.

I’m gonna keep most of my comments at council and I’ll have a lot to say. But I would like to just remind the committee as you and we kind of know where the vote’s gonna go here because it’s quite obvious how it’s gonna work. And there is, part of this will be a public participation meeting and I respectfully ask the committee exactly what question are you gonna be asking and how open are you gonna be to the public comments? Thank you, was that a question for committee or just like one of the rhetorical ones or we did a question for staff about like what they would consider for public feedback with the bylaws?

Well, we understand if this goes through and it looks like the votes will make this go through, there will be a public participation meeting. And I think it’s really important that the committee be open, transparent to hearing feedback from the public. Hey, I took that as an overview of a comment to committees of what they’re open to actually considering. Councillor ramen, and if anyone else would like on the speaker’s list, please indicate so, as currently it would be as exhausted.

Thank you and through you and respectfully, I ask the Councillor to consider the comments made. We all have a duty and obligation when it comes to hearing from the public and we all uphold that duty and responsibility and are open to hearing from the public. And I think that we do not want to do the public with this service and pretend that we’re not going to be listening, that is why the motion on the floor is to have a public participation meeting accompany the bylaw, thank you. Thank you and for clarification, I don’t believe it was our choice to have a public participation meeting, it’s automatically triggered by a new bylaw.

Just for clarification, it’s not how that come today, it wasn’t a council directive, just staff said this is where it comes. Thank you and through you, yes, I understand that, but we also did hear delegation and, you know, I think that at least I can speak for myself. I’m open to hearing from the public on this matter. Thank you.

Thank you, Councillor Troso, you were next on the speaker’s list. Yes, thank you, and I am going to try to make full some comments here because I think this committee really, if we were going to be diligent, we should send this back for some additional information. I think there were a lot of holes in the staff report and I just don’t think attempting to fix them on the fly here is very helpful. Now, on the accreditation, I mean, Casa NAZA are the two gold standard accreditation bodies.

There are others that come along that are lax, that have been criticized. This will come out in the public participation meeting. This will really come out in the public participation meeting. And if Reptilia cannot even keep, it’s Casa accreditation, I don’t know why we think they are so valuable to have come to London because they’ve really failed.

So this narrative that they’re so good, I think, really needs to be looked at. Now, the animal inventory record, things like the animal inventory record, the animal accommodation plan, the transportation plan, if indeed you’re going to allow offsite transportation of animals. These are things that we need to consider. We just cannot blindly delegate these technical matters to a staff which admittedly is already overworked and does not have expertise in these areas.

And believe me, when this becomes an issue in terms of potential liability, our failure to write these things in the bylaw is going to cost us. It’s really going to cost us. Now, the emergency management and public safety plan, why are the proponents of this zoo so adamant to not have this fully investigated? I would think that you would want the emergency management and public safety plan to be given more attention for liability purposes, but also for public safety purposes because there’s nothing in this bylaw yet that stops them from having a minimum wage employee who has no training in dealing with animals, much less dangerous animals, loading these animals into a car and taking off to a children’s party.

That is not prudent. So finally, this council has had a long and I think proud history of not only upholding notions of animal welfare, but also a public safety. And while I know this vote will come up to the council and it will be very seriously debated there. I really want to just once more appeal to my colleagues on this committee to do the prudent thing.

If you want this to go through, do it the right way, send it back for more information and vote this down tonight or at least vote it in a way where we’re going to get more information. When the public comes to the public participation meeting, they should understand exactly what’s on the table and this is going to be a mess the way this is going. And I think that that does not give us a lot of credibility with the public in terms of accountability and transparency. Thank you.

I appreciate the chance to talk to this committee. Thank you. If councilors refresh their screen, the advice what’s on the floor is in eScribe and there’s already been a mover and a seconder. I had no one else on my speakers list for those in the gallery.

The updated wording is on the screen and I’m just gonna ask the clerk to read out the wording. Okay, is there any further speakers? Councilor Van Murgen, you’d like to speak. Is there anybody else just where we can keep it tight for those who are trying to follow online too of where we’re at?

Okay, so I believe Councilor Van Murgen will be potentially my final speaker. Thank you, Chair. The fact of the matter is this organization, Reptilia has a stellar record as has been stated earlier and I’ve stated on other occasions. With 26 years of experience, they know what they’re doing.

They’re considered experts in their field and we only have to look at their activity. Their actions always speak louder than words. The fact of the matter is they were called upon by the British Columbia Conservation Officers Training Program to conduct the courses, that speaks volumes. They train first responders what a tremendous resource if they were located here in London to train our first responders.

The fact of the matter is there are many considered thousands of households within London that are illegally keeping reptiles. What do first responders do when they don’t have experience? How do they approach it? We saw what happened just perhaps six, maybe seven years ago when a bear found its way close to a high school.

I believe it was near STA and the police were confronted with it, not knowing, not having training on how to handle this and the bear will shot. So these are positives that are coming our way and tonight is a step in that direction to show Londoners and to allow Londoners to experience what other Ontario municipalities are experiencing. The fact of the matter is this is not a startup. They do have the experience, the wherewithal, the know-how, the expertise.

Let’s keep going with this. This is a step in the right direction. Thank you, looking for their final questions or comments on item 4.1, Councillor Ferreira. Thank you, and through you, I’ll keep this very short.

Yeah, Reptilia has been around for a while, but it seems like just with the regulation that we’re trying to push through here with the by-law is missing a lot of things. We’re showing a lack of experience on our end when we have a by-law that looks like this that’s on the floor. We have missed many, many areas that we should be speaking about specifically the mobile live shows and the mobile live shows. And even like a drafted insurance and indemnification, we don’t have anything like that written into it as well.

And, you know, the requirements of a public safety plan, you know, these are things that I feel that should definitely be the most prudent way. If we’re gonna be public stewards here and we’re gonna protect the public and we wanna push these new initiatives through, we need to be really cognizant that we kind of capture everything in any type of by-law that allows this to go forward, especially if it’s going against, you know, a standing precedent that the city has. So I would like to point that out. And also, I would also like to point out is the CASA designation.

You know, Reptilia did lose its designation recently. I’ve been having a little bit of trouble finding background information on why exactly that was. I did find some information, but for me, I would like to see more detail on it, but that designation was lost, which is why I can see one of the amendments on this by-laws for the Zoological Association of America. So it does seem like we’re moving around certain goalposts to make it easier for Reptilia, but I would like to, you know, be prudent as the public steward of the city and, you know, and actually ask these questions and really kind of round out what the by-law actually has if we were to even move forward.

So I just feel like we need to just slow things down and actually just take a moment and actually discuss these things and see if we can put it down on paper before we move forward. I feel like there’s a lot of holes for the amendment on the floor, a lot of holes for the by-law that were on the floor as well. And I feel like we just need to just slow it down and ask these questions. So thank you.

Thank you. Kate, looking for a speaker’s list again, Councillor Stevenson, Councillor Per beble. I just wanted to thank staff for their work on this and for gathering all of the information. And I do feel that they’ve put a lot of time and effort into this.

I just wanted to let them know I appreciate it and I have faith in the work that they’ve done. Thank you, Councillor Per beble. Chair, I would just like to actually say the same things. Thanks to the staff.

But there’s one thing is that I want to mention. Yes, we are passing certain motions, but again, it’s still going to go to the council. I do believe that we are moving forward. On the other hand, I do hope that during this time before the council, the staff will come forward and add some of the issues, some of the points that Councillor Ferris said.

But those things, what were mentioned, they wouldn’t be in the by-law, in the motion anyways. They would not be. So yes, we are going to move forward in this case, but the staff, I do hope that they’ll come up. To be honest with you, I was hoping that some of the information we would already receive in terms of the insurance, et cetera, and all three parties involved, city, reptilia, and also Vaspamal.

But I don’t think we should have been with our restrictions more clear. But again, it does, this still goes to the council and staff will have and we will. I will, I think my colleagues as well, we will talk to the staff and prepare more items that we protect our community. Thank you.

Okay, I would like this to be the final call for questions or comments. Okay, just from the chair, my vote will remain the same as it has since 2018 to this evening as being a no for all those reasons and many that you’ve heard in opposition to this. I’m gonna ask the city clerk to read out the wording on the screen for everyone who’s following along online who can’t see it, can also know what’s being voted on this evening. Through the chair that the revised proposed by-law be referred to a future meeting of the community and protective services committee for a public participation meeting.

And part B, that the delegations listed on the added agenda be referred to the above noted public participation meeting. That’s already been moved and seconded by Councillor Stevenson and Councillor Pribble calling the question. Those in the vote, the motion carries three to zero or three, two, sorry. Thank you.

Just for those watching online in the gallery, once again, and for those of committee, this item as with everything that we’ve been working on throughout our different standing committees, go to council for a full vote on February 14th. And if it does pass, the proposed public participation meeting date will be at the caps meeting in March. So you’ll be welcome back then. And anyone who pre-registered to speak will get notification of the date once it’s known.

That concludes section four. Deferred matters and additional business. I was aware that Councillor Pribble had a question. Through the chair to this staff, I just wanted there were certain updates in terms of the winter program for our homelessness.

Thank you. Mr. Dickens. Thank you and through you chair.

Happy to provide an update, recently announced as of late yesterday that Safe Space London was able to securely a location to deliver their portion of the winter response, which is to create up to 20 overnight spaces for vulnerable women. So that location has been secured for a temporary basis while they provide an acute response during the winter months. The rest of the winter response through the leadership of London Cares and at LOSA is pretty well fully operational. So as we look at daytime resting spaces, partners in the community such as Arcade are fully operational at two different locations.

London Cares has successfully opened up their hub at 602 Queens Ave. In the first two weeks of operation, they’ve served over 500 individuals. They’ve provided over 150 different showers for folks. And they’re seeing the immediate impacts of collaboration and new opportunities to work together through primary health and through some of our inner community health clinic staff members around getting people access to ID.

So overnight spaces are up and running, fully occupied daytime space as well utilized, and we continue to see more services come online and become available as people collaborate, find new locations, and we work through the winter response. Thank you. Thank you, Councillor, a follow up. Thank you for the update.

Councillor Stevenson. Thank you and through the chair. I was just wondering when a new, like for instance, these 20 new spaces that were the arrangement was made, looking to in this, you know, regarding the health and homeless summit and wanting to come together as a community based response. We’ve got the vulnerable community and the social service agencies.

We’ve got the business community and the residential community. And I wondered when a new lease is signed or a new thing is brought in. Is there any consultation with the business and the residential community to make sure that it works for all three of those parties to staff? In some cases through the chair, sorry.

In some cases, there will be consultation, absolutely. In this instance, this was a program deliverable that was behind schedule in terms of not being able to find a location. We did work with some community partners to secure the space. We did work through our internal partners to ensure that it was zoned accordingly.

And given that it was an immediate opportunity to move in operationalize the space and it was zoned accordingly, we did enter into a short-term lease agreement on this property without any fulsome consultation in that community. As we look forward to the health and homelessness summit and we look to bring forward to council a whole of community system and a model to be presented before you, the mobilization of that work will certainly make sure we follow as many of the appropriate channels as possible in terms of consultation, making sure that services are where people are at. And given the nature of the work and the volume of the work, I imagine those services will be decentralized throughout the community. So there’ll be some robust communication required.

Councillor Stevenson. Yeah, just a quick thought and recommendation on that that if there’s no time for a fulsome communication, I think checking in with the BIA’s in the core area to ensure that we’re not interfering with their core area action plan and trying to do the revitalization downtown. I think it’s really important that there’s communication and that there’s no surprises and that we can work together as a team. Councillor Troso.

In light of the developments of the last few days, particularly the developments coming out of the Waterloo region, I’m curious what the current status is of removing in campuses. Mr. Dickens. Thank you and through the chair.

So we’ve been following that situation closely since it’s been announced and that the ruling has come down. At this point, London has been working in advance of this ruling to take a compassionate approach when it comes to encampments. We’ve taken a very different strategy than Waterloo has. And so while that verdict and ruling certainly impacts the regional municipality of Waterloo, we’re gonna keep an eye on it.

We’re actually meeting to discuss, you know, what impacts, if any, it does have for us as a municipality. But in London, we’ve been trying to take a very different and compassionate approach to encampments where if there’s a need to relocate people, it’s based on safety reasons because where they’re currently at is not safe for whatever environmental reason or physical impact that could occur to them. And we do that through consultation with outreach workers who do that work on a daily basis so that we can assist the individuals to find a space that may still be outdoors, but would be deemed safer for their wellbeing. So at this point, we operate differently than regional Waterloo does.

I don’t see an immediate impact, but we are going through the very lengthy court ruling and the judges announcement to make sure that we fully understand what it means for Waterloo and then also what it means for London. Thank you. Follow-up. Yes, please, through the chair.

Do you believe at this point in time today, the city of London has enough compliant shelter spaces within the meaning of the judges ruling that we would be able to remove and cabins? Mr. Dickens. Through the chair, I don’t imagine any municipality in Ontario has enough shelter spaces to support the individuals experiencing homelessness in their communities.

It is an Ontario-wide challenge, it is an Ontario-wide problem. And that is why the work that we’re doing at the Health and Homelessness Summit is gonna be so pivotal. In creating spaces that are safe for people to access, in creating spaces where people can have safe shelter, whatever that might look like. In terms of traditional large congregate living shelter spaces, no London operates a 304 bed shelter system.

We flex that during the winter months, we have resting spaces, but we do not currently, nor would any municipalities, I don’t suspect, have enough shelter spaces to meet the individuals that are experiencing homelessness in their communities. Thank you, I appreciate that, and I’ll leave it there for tonight. Thank you. Looking for any other questions or comments for additional business.

Seeing none, we’ve already dealt with confidential section 6.1 that moves us to seven for adjournments, I need a mover. Councillor ramen, seconder, Councillor Prabble, a hand vote of all those in favor of adjourning for the today, the clerk advised me it’s carried. Thank you and have a lovely evening.