June 13, 2023, at 4:00 PM

Original link

The meeting was called to order at 4:00 PM.

1.   Disclosures of Pecuniary Interest

None.

2.   Consent

Moved by E. Peloza

Seconded by C. Rahman

That Items 2.1 to 2.3 and 2.5 to 2.10 BE APPROVED.

Motion Passed (6 to 0)

2.1   6th Report of the Animal Welfare Community Advisory Committee

2023-06-01 - AWCAC - Report - 6

Moved by E. Peloza

Seconded by C. Rahman

That the following actions be taken with respect to the 6th Report of the Animal Welfare Community Advisory Committee, from the meeting held on June 1, 2023:

a)    the following actions be taken with respect to the attached report from the Animal Welfare Community Advisory Committee Sub-Committee:

i)    the above-noted report BE FORWARDED to the Environmental Stewardship and Action Community Advisory Committee (ESACAC); and,

ii)    the ESACAC BE REQUESTED to consider the following actions from the above-noted report:

A)    the recommendations;

B)    the proposed language for the brochure;

C)    the image from the Upper Thames River Conservation Authority signage; and,

D)    the example from the Province of Alberta’s Don’t Let it Loose Campaign;

it being noted that the above-noted report from the Animal Welfare Community Advisory Committee Sub-Committee was received;

b)    clauses 1.1, 3.1, 3.2, 5.1, 5.3 and 5.4 BE RECEIVED.

Motion Passed

2.2   London’s Newcomer Strategy - Choose London –Innovative, Vibrant and Global

2023-06-13 - Staff Report - (2.6) - London Newcomer Strategy Choose London Innovative VibrantGlobal-Full

Moved by E. Peloza

Seconded by C. Rahman

That, on the recommendation of the City Manager, the staff report dated June 13, 2023, with respect to London’s Newcomer Strategy: Choose London – Innovative, Vibrant and Global, BE RECEIVED. (2023-L08)

Motion Passed

2.3   Completion of Downtown Camera Program and Code of Practice Information Report

2023-06-13 - Staff Report - (2.8) - Downtown Camera Program and Code of Practice Information Report - Full

Moved by E. Peloza

Seconded by C. Rahman

That, on the recommendation of the City Manager, the following actions be taken with respect to the staff report dated June 13, 2023, related to the Completion of the Downtown Camera Program and Code of Practice Information Report:

a)    the information, as appended to the above-noted staff report, with respect to the Civic Administration’s approach for the completion of the Downtown Camera Program, BE RECEIVED; and,

b)    the revised London Downtown Closed-Circuit Television (CCTV) Program Code of Practice, as appended to the above-noted staff report, BE APPROVED. (2023-C08/P15A)

Motion Passed

2.5   Neighbourhood Decision Making Program Fairness and Equity Review

2023-06-13 - Staff Report (2.2) - Neighbourhood Decision Making Program Fairness and Equity Review

Moved by E. Peloza

Seconded by C. Rahman

That, on the recommendation of the Deputy City Manager, Neighbourhood and Community-Wide Services, the staff report dated June 13, 2023, with respect to the Neighbourhood Decision Making Program Fairness and Equity Review, BE RECEIVED. (2023-S12)

Motion Passed

2.6   London Fire Department Single Source Traffic Management System Vehicle Monitoring Units

2023-06-13 - Staff Report - (2.3) - LFD Single Source Traffic Management System Vehicle Monitoring Units

Moved by E. Peloza

Seconded by C. Rahman

That, on the recommendation of the Deputy City Manager, Neighbourhood and Community-Wide Services, the following actions be taken with respect to the staff report, dated June 13, 2023, related to London Fire Department Single Source Traffic Management System Vehicle Monitoring Units:

a)    in accordance with Section 14.4(d) of the Procurement of Goods and Services Policy, Fire Administration BE AUTHORIZED to enter into negotiations with Applied Information Inc. of 510-4411 Suwanee Dam Road, Suwanee, Georgia, 30024, USA for pricing for a single source contract for one (1) year with three (3) option years for the provision of vehicle monitoring units to the London Fire Department;

b)    the approval in a), above, BE CONDITIONAL upon The Corporation of the City of London negotiating satisfactory prices, terms, conditions, and entering into a contract with Applied Information Inc. to provide vehicle monitoring units to the London Fire Department; and,

c)    the Civic Administration BE AUTHORIZED to undertake all the administrative acts that are necessary in connection with the above-noted authorizations. (2023-L04)

Motion Passed

2.7   London Fire Department Single Source Request for Fire Apparatus - SS-2023-172

2023-06-13 - Staff Report - (2.4) - London Fire Department Single Source Request for Fire Apparatus - Full

Moved by E. Peloza

Seconded by C. Rahman

That, on the recommendation of the Deputy City Manager, Neighbourhood and Community-Wide Services, the following actions be taken with respect to the staff report, dated June 13, 2023, related to London Fire Department Single Source Request for Fire Apparatus (SS-2023-172):

a)    in accordance with Section 14.4(g) of the Procurement of Goods and Services Policy, Fire Administration BE AUTHORIZED to enter into negotiations with City View Specialty Vehicles, 1213 Lorimar Drive, Mississauga, ON, L5S 1M9, for pricing for a single source contract for one (1) year (2023) with four (4) option years (2024-2027) for the provision of Fire Apparatus to the London Fire Department;

b)    the London Fire Department BE AUTHORIZED to procure four (4) Fire Apparatus: 1 Pumper Rescue, 1 Tanker Pumper, 1 Heavy Rescue, and 1 Decontamination Response Vehicle from City View Specialty Vehicles, for $7,895,136 (excluding HST), including a contingency for currency exchange rate; and,

c)    the funding for this 2023 procurement BE APPROVED as set out in the Source of Financing Report, as appended to the above-noted staff report. (2023-V01)

Motion Passed

2.8   London Fire Department Single Source Request for a Decontamination Pod Report - SS-2023-171

2023-06-13 - Staff Report - (2.5) - London Fire Department Single Source Request for a Decontamination Pod Report- Full

Moved by E. Peloza

Seconded by C. Rahman

That, on the recommendation of the Deputy City Manager, Neighbourhood and Community-Wide Services, the following actions be taken with respect to the staff report, dated June 13, 2023, related to London Fire Department Single Source Request for a Decontamination Pod Report (SS-2023-171):

a)    in accordance with Section 14.4(e) of the Procurement of Goods and Services Policy, Fire Administration BE AUTHORIZED to enter into negotiations with Advanced Containment Systems Inc, (ACSI) 8720 Lambright Rd., Houston, TX, 77075, for the purchase of one (1) Decontamination Pod;

b)    the London Fire Department BE AUTHORIZED to procure one (1) Decontamination Pod that will replace the current Decontamination Trailer; it being noted that the Decontamination Pod will be procured from Advanced Containment Systems Inc, for $362,731 CAD ($251,168 USD at current exchange rate) (excluding HST), including a contingency for currency exchange rate, and with a minimum 50% downpayment at time of order; and,

c)    the funding for this procurement BE APPROVED as set out in the Source of Finance Report, as appended to the above-noted staff report. (2023-V01)

Motion Passed

2.9   Recreation Activity Management System Contract Extension

2023-06-13 - Staff Report - (2.10) - Recreation Activity Management System Contract Extension - Full

Moved by E. Peloza

Seconded by C. Rahman

That, on the recommendation of the Deputy City Manager, Neighbourhood and Community-Wide Services, the proposed by-law, as appended to the staff report dated June 13, 2023, BE INTRODUCED at the Municipal Council meeting on June 27, 2023, to:

a)    approve the terms within the original 2018 PerfectMind Agreement, as appended to the above-noted by-law, between PerfectMind Inc. and The Corporation of the City of London for two additional five-year renewal periods;

b)    approve the PerfectMind Contract Extension Agreement between PerfectMind Inc. and The Corporation of the City of London, substantially in the form appended to the above-noted by-law;

c)    delegate authority to the Deputy City Manager, Neighbourhood and Community-Wide Services to execute the above-noted Contract Extension Agreement;

d)    delegate authority to the Deputy City Manager, Neighbourhood and Community-Wide Services, or written delegate, to execute further amending agreements;

e)    delegate authority to the Deputy City Manager, Neighbourhood and Community-Wide Services, or written delegate, to undertake all administrative acts that are necessary in regards to the above-noted Contract Extension Agreement. (2023-R06/L04)

Motion Passed

2.10   2019-2023 Multi-Sector Service Accountability Agreement - Dearness Home Adult Day Program and Ontario Health West - Declaration of Compliance – April 1, 2022 – March 31, 2023

2023-06-13 - Staff Report - (2.12) - 2019-2023 Accountability Agreement Dearness Home Adult Day Program - Full

Moved by E. Peloza

Seconded by C. Rahman

That, on the recommendation of the Deputy City Manager, Social and Health Development, the Deputy City Manager, Social and Health Development BE AUTHORIZED to execute the Declaration of Compliance with respect to compliance with the terms of the 2019-2023 Multi-Sector Service Accountability Agreement Dearness Home Adult Day Program and Ontario Health West for the reporting period of April 1, 2022 to March 31, 2023, as appended to the staff report dated June 13, 2023. (2023-S03)

Motion Passed

2.4   Delegation of Authority for Municipal Contribution Agreements for Affordable Housing

2023-06-13 - Staff Report - (2.10)-Delegation of Authority for Municipal Contribution Agreements for Affordable Housing

That, on the recommendation of the Deputy City Manager, Planning and Economic Development the following action be taken with respect to the staff report, dated June 13, 2023, related to the Delegation of Authority for Municipal Contribution Agreements for Affordable Housing:

a)    the proposed by-law, as appended to the above-noted staff report, BE INTRODUCED at the Municipal Council meeting on June 27, 2023, to:

i)    authorize the Deputy City Manager, Planning and Economic Development, or their written designate, to approve and execute an agreement of assignment and assumption related to a Contribution Agreement between an affordable housing provider and The Corporation of the City of London;

ii)    authorize the Deputy City Manager, Planning and Economic Development, or their written designate, to approve and execute an amending agreement related to a Contribution Agreement between an affordable housing provider and The Corporation of the City of London to approve a rent increase for operations in financial difficulty; it being noted that no rent for affordable units in a building to which a Contribution Agreement between an affordable housing provider and The Corporation of the City of London applies shall exceed 80% of Average Market Rent or Median Market Rent for a rental unit, by unit type, as determined by the Canada Mortgage Housing Corporation;

iii)    authorize the Deputy City Manager, Planning and Economic Development, or their written designate, to approve and execute an amendment to the Contribution Agreement to provide for additional permitted encumbrances, to consent to postponements of the City’s security under a Contribution Agreement and to approve and execute priority, standstill and subordination agreements satisfactory to the City Solicitor’s Office;

iv)    authorize the Deputy City Manager, Planning and Economic Development, or their written designate, to amend a Contribution Agreement between an affordable housing provider and The Corporation of the City of London to add requirements related to the affordable housing units, to add further affordable housing units, to address approved changes to the development schedule, project information form or increases to the equity contribution made by the affordable housing provider; 

v)    authorize the Deputy City Manager, Planning and Economic Development, or their written designate, to amend a Contribution Agreement between an affordable housing provider and The Corporation of the City of London to attaching or detaching a property from/to the Contribution Agreement as long as it is not in the detriment or loss of the total number of affordable units;

b)     the Civic Administration BE DIRECTED to report, semi-annually, outlining the actions taken by the Deputy City Manager, Planning and Economic Development, under the delegations under the by-law along with an update on equity retention discussion; it being noted that this report will be included as an appendix to the semi-annual Roadmap 3000 update;

it being noted that the communication, as appended to the Added Agenda, and the verbal delegation, from G. Playford, Devonshire Consulting, with respect to this matter, were received. (2023-S11)

Motion Passed

Additional Votes:

Moved by S. Stevenson

Seconded by E. Peloza

Motion to approve the delegation request, as appended to the Added Agenda, from G. Playford, with respect to this matter, to be heard at this time.

Motion Passed (6 to 0)

Moved by E. Peloza

Seconded by J. Pribil

Motion to approve part a) of the clause.

Motion Passed (6 to 0)

Moved by S. Stevenson

Seconded by J. Pribil

Motion to approve part b) of the clause.

Motion Passed (6 to 0)

3.   Scheduled Items

3.1   Housekeeping Amendments - Administrative Monetary Penalty Systems and Business Licensing By-law

2023-06-13 - Staff Report - (3.1) - Housekeeping Amendments – Administrative Penalty Systems and Licensing By-law

Moved by E. Peloza

Seconded by C. Rahman

That, on the recommendation of the Deputy City Manager, Planning and Economic Development, the following actions be taken with respect to the staff report dated June 13, 2023, related to Housekeeping Amendments to the Administrative Monetary Penalty Systems and Business Licensing By-law:

a)    the proposed by-law, as appended to the above-noted staff report, BE INTRODUCED at the Municipal Council meeting to be held on June 27, 2023, to amend By-law No. A-54, as amended, being “A by-law to implement an Administrative Monetary Penalty System in London” to repeal and replace Schedules “A-2” through to “A-22” and “A-26” through to “A-27”;

b)    the revised proposed by-law, as appended to the Added Agenda, BE INTRODUCED at the Municipal Council meeting to be held on June 27, 2023, to amend By-law No. L.-131-16, being “A by-law to provide for the Licensing and Regulation of Various Businesses” in order to update processes and definitions, clean up grammar throughout, save and except for amendments to remove the Adult Entertainment Body Rub Parlour location at 609 Clarke Road (formerly operating as Sweet City) for which a public participation meeting be held in the future to provide for public comments for the removal of this location from the by-law; and,

c)    the Civic Administration BE DIRECTED to provide a Draft Terms of Reference in the fall of 2023 related to a thorough review of the Business Licensing By-law, which will outline the detail of public outreach and participation to occur throughout 2024. (2023-C01A)

Motion Passed (6 to 0)

4.   Items for Direction

4.1   Occupant Noise Enforcement - Partnered Pilot Project Update

2023-06-13 - Staff Report - (2.1) - Occupant Noise Enforcement - Partnered Pilot Project Update

Moved by E. Peloza

Seconded by S. Stevenson

That, on the recommendation of the Deputy City Manager, Planning and Economic Development, the following actions be taken with respect to the staff report, dated June 13, 2023, related to the Occupant Noise Enforcement Partnered Pilot Project:

a)    the above-noted staff report BE RECEIVED;

b)    the Civic Administration BE DIRECTED to continue the partnered Occupant Noise Enforcement program; and,

c)    the Civic Administration BE DIRECTED to bring forward as part of a multi-year budget, a business case that provides funding to continue and improve the intake of the partnered Occupant Noise Enforcement program or other service improvements. (2023-P01)

Motion Passed (6 to 0)

Additional Votes:

Moved by S. Stevenson

Seconded by C. Rahman

Motion to amend part c) of the staff recommendation to read:

c)     the Civic Administration BE DIRECTED to bring forward as part of a multi-year budget a business case that provides funding to continue and improve the intake of the partnered Occupant Noise Enforcement program or other service improvements.

Motion Passed (6 to 0)

4.2   Fireworks By-Law Options Report

2023-06-13 - Staff Report - (2.7) - Fireworks By-Law Options Report

That, on the recommendation of the Deputy City Manager, Neighbourhood and Community-Wide Services, the following actions be taken with respect to the staff report dated June 13, 2023, related to Fireworks By-law Options:

a)    the Civic administration BE DIRECTED to hold a public participation meeting at a future of the Community and Protective Services Committee (CPSC) in order to receive comments on proposed changes to the Fireworks By-law PW-11; it being noted that additional direction to the Civic Administration will be provided, following the consideration of comments and submissions at the public participation meeting;

b)    the Civic Administration BE DIRECTED to report back at a future meeting of the CPSC summarizing public comments including the submission of a draft by-law amendment; and,

c)    the requests for delegation, as appended to the Agenda and the Added Agenda, from V.R. Anber and A. Kanji BE DEFERRED to the above-noted future public participation meeting with respect to this matter;

it being noted that the communications, as appended to the Agenda and the Added Agenda, from the following individuals, with respect to this matter, were received:

  •    V.R. Anber;

  •    A. Kanji;

  •    M. Luce;

  •    Brandy;

  •    D. Ronson and B. Amendola; and,

  •    J. Morton and A. Haase. (2023-P01)

Motion Passed

Additional Votes:

Moved by C. Rahman

Seconded by S. Stevenson

Motion to approve parts a) and b) of the clause.

Motion Passed (6 to 0)

Moved by E. Peloza

Seconded by J. Pribil

Motion to approve part c) of the clause.

Motion Passed (5 to 1)

4.3   Encampment Response Update

Moved by C. Rahman

Seconded by J. Pribil

That, on the recommendation of the Deputy City Manager, Social and Health Development, the following actions be taken with respect to the staff report, dated June 13, 2023, related to the Encampment Response Update:

a)    the funding allocation, from the Social Services Reserve Fund, for the total municipal allocation amount of up to $255,000.00 BE APPROVED to support a portion of the costs of the Phase 1 Encampment Response on a temporary basis as outlined in the above-noted report;

b)    a one-time contract amendment of existing agreements, in the total estimated cost of $100,000, BE AUTHORIZED and BE APPROVED to support London Cares and Canadian Mental Health Association (CMHA);

c)    the Civic Administration BE AUTHORIZED to undertake all administrative acts which are necessary in relation to this project;

d)    the approval given, herein, BE CONDITIONAL upon the Corporation amending a Purchase of Service Agreement, and;

e)    the Deputy City Manager, Social and Health Development, or written designate, BE DELEGATED authority to take all necessary action to implement Phase 1 of the Encampment Response. (2023-F11A)

Motion Passed (4 to 1)

4.4   (ADDED) Councillor J. Pribil - Winter Response Program

2023-06-13 - (4.4) - Winter Response Program - J Pribil

Moved by J. Pribil

Seconded by S. Stevenson

That the Civic Administration BE DIRECTED to include a year over year comparison, for the past three years (2020-2021, 2021-2022, 2022-2023), on the number of bed days available/occupied, number of bed nights available/occupied, number of hours service bed facility, number of hours service non-bed facility and total expenses, with the Winter Response Program Outcome Report at the August meeting of the Community and Protective Services Committee. (2023-C04)

Motion Passed (4 to 1)

5.   Deferred Matters/Additional Business

5.1   Deferred Matters List

2023-06-13 - (5.1) - Deferred Matters List

Moved by C. Rahman

Seconded by S. Stevenson

That the Deferred Matters List for the Community and Protective Services Committee, as at May 16, 2023, BE RECEIVED.

Motion Passed (5 to 0)

6.   Confidential

Moved by C. Rahman

Seconded by S. Stevenson

That the Community and Protective Services Committee convene In Closed Session for the purpose of considering the following:

6.1    Litigation/Potential Litigation

A matter pertaining to litigation or potential litigation and advice that is subject to solicitor-client privilege, including communications necessary for that purpose.

6.2    Solicitor-Client Privilege/Position, Plan, Procedure, Criteria or Instruction for Negotiation Purposes

A matter pertaining to advice that is subject to solicitor-client privilege, including communications necessary for that purpose, and for the purpose of providing instructions and directions to officers and employees or the Corporation and a position, plan, procedure, criteria or instruction to be applied to any negotiations carried on or to be carried on by or on behalf of the municipality or local board.

Motion Passed (5 to 0)

The Community and Protective Services Committee convened In Closed Session from 8:03 PM to 9:15 PM.

7.   Adjournment

The meeting adjourned at 9:18 PM.

Full Transcript

Transcript provided by Lillian Skinner’s London Council Archive. Note: This is an automated speech-to-text transcript and may contain errors. Speaker names are not identified.

View full transcript (4 hours, 15 minutes)

testing testing that’s good thank thank you all right good evening everyone I’ll be calling to order the 10th meeting of the community and protective services committee and just for everyone to know I’m the vice chair but I’ll be chairing today as counselor Palosa she has asked me to do so and just let you know I was involved in the pre-meeting so I do have a little bit of background and I should be as prepared as possible the city of London is situated on the traditional lands of the Anishinaabek, Haudenosaunee, Lina Peiwach, and Adwanderin we honor and respect the city or the history language and culture of the diverse indigenous people who call this territory home the city of London is currently home to many First Nations Métis and Inuit today as representatives of the people of the city of London we are grateful to have the opportunity to work and live in this territory so I’ll start with disclosures of pecuniary interest all right so on the consent items today I do know that we may have 2.4 being pulled and I wanted to know if there’s any other consent items to be pulled by the committee so if I could have a motion to receive consent items 2.1 to 2.10 with the exception of 2.4 I have motion council Palosa is moving that and do I have a seconder okay I have a seconder councilor ramen and councilor Palosa so let’s call that question I apologize let’s start with questions or comments on the consent items councilor Pribble it’s not that tough I’ll start easy as for the chair to the staff 2.2 and then you come with strategy I just had a question in terms of it’s a five-year strategy and we are gonna start phase two now this December and the first five years or almost five years in the phase one was it mainly collection data or did you already and maybe I missed it but did you already come up during the last five years with certain initiatives to address these the findings of the data which I think the data is great but my question is now did we do any initiatives or all the initiatives are gonna start now in phase two starting December thank you to the staff I thank you and I’d like to invite Ms. Tansley to come up she is the lead of this initiative and very deeply knowledgeable just give her a minute to walk to the microphone thank you very much and through the chair so there has been quite a bit of data collection already during the first five years of the strategy and you will see in fact attached as one of I think it’s appendix B there’s a newcomer survey which was done just a few months ago of Londoners of sorry both residents in London residents in the greater Toronto area and residents in other parts of southwestern Ontario and the data from that survey gives us some very interesting information which we can put to use in phase two of the report of the strategy thank you I’m sorry the city manager is just pointing out that you asked about other initiatives so there have been many other initiatives there are city internships for international student graduates there has been newcomer day which has been running since 2019 and will will happen again this mid October there has been quite a bit of advocacy work with the federal government on barriers to barriers that immigrants face there’s been work with employment agencies so work on the immigration portal which is a vehicle to attract and retain residents Council okay no thank you for the answer and I hope in phase two we’ll have even more initiatives I think the data is truly fantastic but I hope we’ll put it to good use and also leverage the other two levels of government because I’m quite sure there are financial opportunities and make everyone welcome and integrate them to our community as fast as we can but thank you for your answers no more questions and I have Councillor ramen next on the speaker’s list thank you and through you first I want to thank staff for the report on item 2.2 the London’s newcomer strategy always grateful for this work and the perspective that Miss Tansley and others bring to this strategy however I want to express some concerns I have with with some of the what we’re not looking at yet and I think one of the things we’re starting to see and especially with where Fanshawe and Western have went with international student recruitment is we are seeing considerable change in our community when it comes to the quality of life for international students and I’m wondering how we can do a better job of helping to advocate as a city for better measures at the federal level at the provincial level for international students how we can better align our you know our house what’s going on in our housing crisis with how we’re taking on more international students in this this market and in this city I feel like there is a crisis brewing around international students and the challenges they are experiencing around quality of life I’ve heard anecdotally from our food banks the increase that they’re seeing in international students coming and needing some support as well so I’m wondering how how do we put more of a lens on on that impact that it’s have hanging in our city thanks thank you to the staff thank you and through the chair that’s an excellent question so the newcomer strategy has been keeping a breast of concerns which we first noticed in other municipalities specifically around the quality of life and mental health of international students and as you know we have almost 13,000 international students in London spread out through the college and the university and the affiliated colleges all five of those bodies are represented on the advisory body of the newcomer strategy so we are in close touch with them and in fact when it comes to advocacy specifically with the federal government international students and their pathways to permanent residency have been at the top of the agenda of the newcomer strategy advisory body concerning housing I have recently joined the internal housing supply reference group and I was able to make a presentation last month to the meeting of that reference group specifically on newcomers the population trends their housing needs and housing needs by all categories of immigration whether whether they’re economic immigrants or permanent residents refugees international students so hoping that conversation will continue and concerns of international students will be taken into account thank you counselor thank you and I appreciate that and you know it’s it’s imperative I think that we understand that we’re having this conversation around a strategy but that we know that there is a lot of suffering going on and and you know the other piece of this separate to this strategy is you know this is in the backdrop to a large number of international students that are sitting facing deportation orders right now because they picked Canada as the country to come to and and were you know led down a path by by folks in their home countries that gave them the wrong information and defrauded them so you know I think that there’s probably more that we have to do as a city as it as we move forward around international students and how we’re supporting them in the future and an understanding more about how we bring those voices at the table I’m encouraged to see that we have a 20-week program that where we’re we’re able to take in international students because sometimes that credentialing and that ability to take in students because of visa requirements is also challenging so to see that two students were able to do that it’s great we’d love to see that expand would love to see that expand with our community partners and other agencies as well thank you and I have counselor Palosa next on speakers list thank you mr. chair and just briefly a comment to counselor ramen’s insightful and thoughtful points that she was making absolutely we’ve seen that in south London to international students as we have a south campus really struggling and we know food places are storing for everyone and just really struggling when they have when they’re here and realizing that they’re guests in London as well as much as they are contributors and making sure that everyone has what they need to to prosper when they’re here with us so thank you for those comments and to staff for the work that they’re doing to make everyone feel welcome and part of the community my questions today are gonna surround items 2.6 2.7 and 2.8 just for the appropriate staff can be prepared and through you it’s just going to be asking staff for a general update as this is several cycles in a row that we’ve seen requests coming from the London fire department realizing the fire master plan has been updated and within it we’ve seen the lifecycle of these equipment being 17 years front line three years is back up now being amended to 12 years front line three years back up and with wait times of 24 months for some of this equipment eight months for others and realizing the huge cost of inflation I believe it was about six percent every three months and some of it’s tying to the multi-year budget so just looking forward to through you mr. chair to staff of do we anticipate more requests coming before we get to the multi-year budget process this fall and if you want just to highlight the urgency at this equipment I’m not questioning its urgency but just for everyone understands that it keeps breaking parts are in short supply if we can find them and to really help keep those frontline workers safe as we were also just celebrating 150 years of the London fire department service to Londoners I believe that one’s for Miss Smith thank you and for the chair I’ll start with that and I also have acting chief Hayes on on zoom so this I cannot say a hundred percent because hopefully nothing will break down or we’ll have an catastrophic breakdown of one of our vehicles but this is the last four that we are asking for right now as part of the current 2023 budget any remaining vehicles will will be part of actually the next two to three multi-year budgets to get us moved from a 20 year life cycle to a 15 year life cycle for vehicles the reason for this is again we had an opportunity to do group buying of these vehicles that means we can lock in the price we can get it at a reasonable price we have a better chance of negotiating to get all the vehicles in 18 to 24 months we will be working with the dealer and hopefully getting if we can get that shave down at all so that really puts the pressure on so that’s why we are looking for this one-time purchase of four vehicles right now and then plus the de-contamination pod which will go with one of the vehicles and then the remaining vehicles will be part of the next two to three multi-year budget processes and built into those capital plans counselor thank you just didn’t know if chief Hayes had anything he wanted to add on to that as he is virtually with us and just this is the last and happy to support this but just it is a big ass every time it comes but definitely important ones please go ahead chief Hayes thank you for through you mr.

Chair appreciate the the question counselor and I just concur with Ms. Smith there with her comments it is very challenging to make sure that we’re maintaining our fleet especially the ones that are having significant issues that we’re really coming to the end of the lifecycle before the 20 years under the old lifecycle so it is a welcome change to to move this lifecycle under the fire master plan to a 15 year total cycle and hopefully get these problematic vehicles out of our fleet but at the same time that does come with the cost so we’ve tried to balance that overall cost with the circumstances of the community to make sure that it’s affordable and as Ms. Smith did note that we will be bringing that forward in the next multi-year budget oh you’re good okay next on the list is deputy mayor Lewis thank you mr. Presiding officer and through you I was actually going to speak to just one of the two items on the consent but I will also share both the appreciation to Ms.

Tansley for her work on the newcomer strategy but I would also encourage colleagues particularly when it comes to the issue of international students and their needs that as elected officials I think we all have a responsibility to reach out to our respective members of parliament as well as to our secondary post-secondary institution heads and have these discussions with them as well ultimately this is a federal matter and while the city has a role to play the federal government certainly has a role to play in this as well you know deportation orders aren’t issued by the city they’re issued by immigration refugee and citizenship Canada and I think there’s a really important discussion that needs to be had with our members of parliament around that elected official to elected official I wanted to actually comment on the neighborhood decision-making update and even as I was coming in I had the opportunity to ask deputy city manager Ms. Smith who the new Karen Oldham was so that I could direct a school her way for some assistance was starting to think about their neighborhood decision-making application in the fall I really appreciate this report I know we’ve we’ve really asked staff to take a serious look at neighborhood decision-making and how it balances out around the city I know that both Councillor Palose and I have raised questions in the past about eligibility for school yard projects and around other areas of engagement I’m really pleased to see that there will be some additional focus around engagement in those higher social risk areas and I think that’s appropriate because I think that’s where the engagement has the most benefit I think it’s incumbent on us as Councillors as well to engage with our communities and make that opportunity known to folks I certainly engage with my school communities about this I’ve come a long way in my thought process in terms of allowing school projects to be considered because I’ve come to see as I’ve thought about this over time how much our school yards actually function as de facto parks in the evenings and how in some cases we even have agreements with the school boards for use of their facilities for some of our recreational programs so when we’re investing some funding there I’m supportive of that I’m still frustrated that and I’m trying not to look at a former school board trustee but I’m still frustrated that there are board funds that are not being used to rejuvenate some of the playground and yard structures that our students need but I’m really excited to see some of the novel ideas that students bring forward and that actually get some neighborhood decision-making funding including most recently in my ward JP Robart’s elementary school has started the installation of their musical playground which is a whole new playground experience for kids it’s not the traditional swings and climbers there are musical instruments built into the school yard that they get to play with and experiment with that recess time and after school so I just want to say how much I continue to look forward to connecting the community with staff on this program I appreciate the work that they’ve done I think we need to continue to consider how we can make this program better but I will say it’s only a source of continuous improvement I’m pretty happy with the results that I’m seeing from it to date thank you deputy mayor and the next I have on the list would be Mayor Morgan yes thank you on just the consent items in this package I’m gonna start where the deputy mayor left off on neighborhood decision-making as many colleagues know this was something that I proposed in my first term as a counselor and I think it has gone through multiple improvements over a period of time and as was just said you know this is a program that you can continue to make better through experience and thoughtful changes the one thing I’ll emphasize and for those who are on council before know that I always emphasize his piece neighborhood decision-making and our thoughts around it often get driven into the winners and the losers the projects that are successful and the projects that aren’t and what’s often lost in that is the incredible inherent value of the program itself this is a program that gets Londoners to think about how to improve their neighborhood gets them to generate ideas gets them to go out and engage with their neighbors when its school communities pitching ideas gets them to talk about it in the classroom because the voting is open to anyone and everyone of any age this is often the first time people have ever cast a ballot whether that’s a young person or a newcomer in an effort to make their neighborhood better regardless of who wins and loses at the end of the day in that process regardless of what projects come to fruition there is inherent democratic value in the process that people get to engage in when you have a program such as this where it directly and genuinely involves residents in making their community better so I’m really happy with the report I think it’s yet another thoughtful iteration of ways that we can consider improvements to the program but just I want to emphasize with colleagues do not forget the inherent value or a really critical inherent value of the program is just the democratic and civic activity that it spawns because it exists thank you for that that is the end of my speaker’s list do I have anybody else who would like to ask any questions or make some comments D none okay let’s call the question for the consent items for 2.1 to 2.10 with the exception of 2.4 seeing the vote the motion carries 6 to 0 okay next on the list would be 2.4 for the consent delegation of authority for municipal contribution agreements for affordable housing I believe that there is a request for delegation status so question to the committee if you guys are wishing to approve the request for the delegation status I’m also a Stevenson do I have a seconder for that a little below the seconding that question is the delegate here this evening we could hear them right now I see the delegate up in the gallery over there and just for clarification that we hear them tonight yes okay I have a move in a seconder for the delegation so let’s call the question for delegation closing the vote the motion carries 6 to 0 okay that delegation is approved so mr. Playford are you ready thank you mr. Chair and council members just just a second just you got five minutes and that five minutes is starting now thank you for allowing me to speak this probably won’t take the full five minutes I’m here primarily to support the recommendation you know there’s lots happening in the housing sector and any recommendation that can help streamline the decision making is is welcome because of our our great need for affordable housing and this is an area that is administrative and I think that with the support of the city solicitor and the housing staff that they are able to make these decisions and recommendations and I would hope council will we’ll download this responsibility as it’s being recommended there are a couple of concerns because once this does go to into the hands of staff some of the people that are impacted by it do lose some of the input they might otherwise have and part of the concern is around key issue consideration 2.1 I won’t read the memo I wrote I think you all have it there but you know the idea of postponing the debt that’s on a affordable housing project or most of them are old social housing project has an awful lot of merit I mean these are mostly legacy agreements that date from the 1980s they’re reaching the end of their terms the housing providers have lived by all of the rules and requirements for 30 35 years they’ve paid down their mortgages they have assets that are now quadrupled in value in many cases so there’s a great opportunity to leverage that equity and build new affordable housing also to fix up the projects they’re in or to do improvements and other other projects in their portfolios so we want to make sure that staff isn’t stuck with some policies that would limit that and there were two things in 2.1 that were of particular concern one of them the last line in 2.1 would disqualify a group that has a replacement reserve I think that’s wrong in the sense that any group that doesn’t have a capital replacement reserve is probably not somebody that you want to see develop housing further all of our housing providers wherever they can do maintain capital reserves and we all want to see the existing portfolios the projects that are now 30 and 35 years old maintained well so I think that needs to be either eliminated or re-phrased the other concern is the retention of 10% equity and this is a policy that’s every time a non-profit or co-op housing provider goes in to ask for a postponement they do get this put back to them and unfortunately you know what a praise value for a project is a function of income and affordable housing projects have less income and quite often the lower the income the better the affordable housing project because it’s has more affordable units so using a metric to retain equity is is just counterproductive and it could prevent housing providers from capitalizing on the the equity that’s there you know probably I’m not sure the number of agreements the city has staff would know but I think it’s probably around 200 or more and about 90% of those date from the 1980s and early 90s when so much affordable housing was being built so these projects do need money they need money to keep them in good condition but more importantly there is source of income for developing new affordable housing as we’ve seen in Soho vision Soho most of the providers and visit vision Soho have leverage equity from their portfolio mostly see old CMHC ones that the city’s not involved in they’ve put new mortgages on and they’re investing that mortgage in that new project so I think the the hard requirement that the city require 10% equity is a little misaligned I think we want to take every opportunity we can to use the nonprofit sector to produce as much affordable housing as they’re capable of and we don’t want to get stuck with rules that are counterproductive glad to answer any questions thank you mr.

play for so I’m looking for anyone to move staff recommended motion in a seconder and then we’ll have a speakers list after that suppose we’re moving and we have a seconder councilor Pribble is seconding okay and I’m looking for speakers list so Frank thank you I know I’m just visiting but I’m wondering given that the delegate asked for a couple amendments I’m wondering if those are being considered or can be directed to staff for comment and I would direct those questions to staff for comments thank you and through the chair actually we agree completely with mr. play play for there’s actually a bit of a typo in that last line it should say in adequate capital reserve funds or the word not should be in there so we completely agree with him that if an affordable housing project did have had a quick capital reserve that would be a reason for us to postpone that allows us to incent more affordable housing in the community and allows us to build more momentum to building and bringing more units online thank you counselor thank you and I think there is a second part that mr. playford also mentioned that I don’t know if staff have a comment on staff thank you and through the chair so if we’re referring to the second point in the letter about a declining balance it’s actually something we are we’re actively exploring with the Soho group and many of the other affordable housing providers looking to find a way to like he said add more capital order more ability for them to leverage their investment and leverage the building values so that they can again bring more affordable units to market thank you and this isn’t my committee but I’m just wondering if somebody perhaps then wants to make some of those changes before it gets approved and sent to council thank you and there was the one question about the 10% equity if we could get staff’s answer on that to the staff thank you and through the chair so the 10% postponement is a fairly standard item within the community within the affordable housing community that we’ve seen but what I can do is I can offer to work with mr. playford to see if there any other best practices that we can involve and used to to leverage and again bring some more of those units to market with respect to making any changes it’s a typo in the body of the report it’s not a component of the resolution and I would be happy to work with mr.

playford to clarify and work on any improvements we can make thank you counselor thank you mr. maybe mr. playford could make his recommendation that what he would like to see rather than that 10% equity I’m going to mr. playford well I don’t know that you need a hard and fast rule I think it’s more has to be a little more pragmatic it has to be more considered of what the request is and what the funds are being used for it’s important to note that when an existing nonprofit or co-op housing provider goes to get new financing they typically use CMHC insurance and CMHC has a specific program for nonprofits and co-ops and they will provide a new mortgage on a property as long as it can support the mortgage and they will allow the funds to be used for only three purposes and those purposes are to to put do capital improvements in that project to do capital improvements in other projects owned by the same nonprofit entity or to take out funds to build new affordable housing and I mean all across the country this is why we’re seeing so much competition for the available federal funds because co-ops are co-ops and nonprofits are leveraging equity and investing in new housing so I don’t think you can have a hard and fast number that works I think every every request needs to be dealt with on its merits thank you mr.

playford back to counselors students thank you and maybe to staff if they could explain this I’m just a little confused by this request for the delegation I mean we all want the affordable housing and for it to move faster and yet in the six seven months I’ve been here I haven’t seen a lot come through and I’m just it says it’s a normal process and yet we’re being asked to give delegated authority so I’m just wondering is there an anticipated future amount coming because we’re talking about getting an annual report and given the importance of affordable housing I’m reluctant to hand it over and get an annual report on it when I’d really love to know what’s happening more frequently that says a question to the staff I believe so to the staff thank you and through you mr. Chair so a lot of the policies and procedures that we have in this report were policies and procedures of the former HDC so this is a big part of our wind down activity that we are we’ll be bringing forward later in the year so what we’re trying to do is align it with our procedures and policies here and at the city the corporation of the city and then that will allow us to be more efficient bring forward some of these a little bit quicker we do have I’m not sure I think three or four requests right now in front of us they’re actually waiting on this delegation report for us to be able to address some of the postponements and some of the nuances to some of the agreements there’s a couple that are looking to sever parcels but still retain number of units and things like that and those would all be pieces that we would bring forward in our annual report to kind of to highlight the the activities of the art of local community and how we’ve been working with them thank you back to counselor Stevenson thank you when is the next annual report coming for the road map I thought that was coming fairly soon mr. Felbert sure thank you and through you mr. Chair our plan right now we’re looking at some of the there’s a number of different things going on so we have a lot of the implications of bill 23 there were the latest bill I think bill 97 which is another one we’re also looking at different funding program so you have the housing accelerator fund we’re looking for that to complete and then the intention would be to bring back a roadmap update in the fall this particular update that we’re talking about we could bring as part of the road map or we could look to align with some of the other reporting that we do over the course of year either maybe through our annual development report or something like that we haven’t quite landed on the best timing but we want to make sure that you folks are aware of all the work that we’re doing thank you back to counselor Stevenson thank you can I get staff’s opinion on a semi-annual report for the road map for the affordable housing so that we have a more to-date report back to the staff certainly and through you mr.

Chair we do we have reported a couple times since I’ve been in this position you know starting in November we reported out in November and then again in January but I don’t see any issues with us coming with a bi-annual report at this point for on the road map progress thank you and I do remember those other reports but I also remember that they didn’t have a lot of detail or information and that the details were coming so I’d like like I personally I would like the detailed reports semi-annual I really want to be accountable to the public in terms of what it is that we say we’re doing and what actually happens counselor are you wishing to make an amendment to the motion if there is a spot in there to change it from annual to semi-annual then yes I’ll just wait for the counselor to make that amendment I don’t believe there’s anything in there about an annual report so it would have to be added okay I think because we have a motion on the floor that’s been seconded I would like to maybe vote on that first and then we can bring your amendment or second motion to see if you have a seconder on that after or can we just add an extra bit on the bottom that because in the report it does say that it’ll be an annual report and we could just put on the bottom of it a semi-annual report will be provided outlining the detailed actions taken it’s it’s in 2.5 on page 98 okay because it’s an amendment to the motion on the floor I would need to seek look at the mover and the seconder would be in that case I believe that you should be able to put that amendment on the motion it looks like the mover I said no to the amendment so let’s vote on or let’s vote on the motion first and then we’ll see about the amendment after that’s okay counselor sorry procedurally I don’t think that’s correct that the amendment takes presidents over the main motion because it has to be amended before we can vote on it so you would need to have a mover in a seconder as I’m sure can you clerk could tell you to that and we’ll do it that first then dispose of it of moving it from an annual report to a semi-annual report and we’ll go back to the main the main fun okay we have uh Barb Westlake power clerk so let’s hear what Barb has to say about the procedure sorry thank you through the chair because you’re at committee either option is available to you you’re certainly not precluded from voting on the motion that’s on the floor and then entertaining an additional motion uh it’s different than considering a single recommendation at council so out of this committee if there’s two separate motions we would mold them into one full recommendation that would be considered at council but uh it’s really the prerogative of the of the chair to either vote on this motion um as it stands and then introduce an additional motion or you could entertain a separate motion as an amendment entertain a second motion as an amendment and then we’ll go back to the main motion so council Stevenson you have a seconder councilor purple okay and um just looking and if we could just get some clarification on the language for your motion i would direct in page 98 2.5 where it refers to the annual reporting and if it could say semi-annual council do you just mind repeating that just one more time it’s on page 98 2.5 says an annual report will be provided outlining actions taken by the DCM under the delegations made under the attached bylaw and if it could say semi-annual report and it says this report will be included as an appendix to the annual road map 3000 yearly update but again we could just make all that semi-annual the wording is on 2.5 on page 98 thank you council just one moment so other clerk is typing i do have councilor polozan next on the speaker’s list um councilor polozan thank you uh two parts one was just through you um as the typing the typing the wording is still being i’m sorry uh concussion words are heard sometimes just looking to see if it was going to be a semi-annual report and then be like because the annual road map to 3000 as you report if that one’s being requested to be a semi-annual report for the road map to 3002 or if it’s just like a mid-update and then the big update just through you to the mover and two councilor Stevenson thank you and my request that they all say semi-annual staff had mentioned that we’ve already had a couple of updates and i recall them not having the the detail that was helpful in that and that the more detailed reports were coming so if i can just say like i just feel like this is such an important issue for most londoners around affordable housing i think it’s really important to have our pulse on it and to know exactly what’s going on HTC i don’t know much about it but there were a lot of problems which is why it’s changing we’ve got the software issue still out there that residents have concerns around and so i think it’s important to do the due diligence like i said the last report i know i had questions around and we were told the details were coming just recently the 44 units at 403 Thompson have moved from affordable housing to highly supportive and i think it’s important i think a semi-annual update on both of those is really important thank you counselor and i’ll go back to Palosa but just so you know that that language is uploaded in e-scribe now so if you refresh you’ll be able to see that counselor Palosa thank you and for that clarification a question through you to staff realizing we do get updates along the way and some of these are really really big reports and if we’re already having some frustration with wanting more detail but staff is busy doing the work to gather said detail of i’m mindful that we all recognize the crisis we’re in with housing and staff is working diligently and quickly with many community partners i’m worried about the time that we spend making reports and talking about reports versus actually doing the front line work so through you just staff of like what would that look like for their workload and would they be able to do the semi-annual reports now two full semi-annual reports with as much details what the counselor is hoping for thank you counselor Palosa to the staff thank you and through you mr chair so what we could do is we get a line with some of the other reporting cycles and some of the other reports that we bring forward so examples of reports we could use would be like the annual development report which comes out early in the year we also have a provincial requirement to report out on our age staff so the housing stability action plan and a lot of the activities that are part of that plan are really related to bringing more unit more housing units to market as well so what we could do is include a component within that report that identifies some of these some of the counts that you’re looking for and some of the information that you’re looking for so we can certainly find ways to streamline it so that we’re we’re already undertaking reporting we can leverage those processes and those systems to do that and thank you and your satisfied with that counselor Palosa and do i have any other i have counselor ramen thank you and through you i appreciate the amendment here in front of us i’m wondering not that i want to confuse things and add an amendment to an amendment but i’m wondering i know we’ve been talking about the discussion about the retention of the 10 equity i’m just wondering if the update can include that update on that discussion if that’s possible if that needs to be amended in or if it’s just assumed that would come in the next update thank you counselor to the staff sorry just looking for a little bit of clarification you’re looking to amend so when we report back we’ll report back on the status of the 10 postponement as a as a benchmark yeah you mentioned that sorry and through you it was mentioned that discussion would happen with that with mr playford around around how that might be possible and so looking at best practices in other communities seeing that this is a potential challenge for funding partners just wondering how expediently we could come back with an update on that discussion and hoping that semiannually is is is is possible mr valbert thank you and through you mr chair we can certainly do that after we’ve had some opportunities to converse with mr playford and his team will also be coming forward with a number of other items in relation to this work as well so that could be another opportunity where we could provide an update as it relates to this and counselor thank you i guess i’m looking to the mover to see whether or not she thinks the language needs to be added in there around the that particular piece again i just want to make sure that we’re not losing the discussion from today and having to revisit it and remember it in our update that those conversations take precedence as i know we’re all hearing from different organizations that are trying to get their funding together right now and struggling to figure that out so i would love to make that a priority in the next report as well i don’t know if the counselor would consider that as a friendly to her amendment and counselor stevenson yes if the counselor has a recommendation i’d be open to it in the one that’s on the floor right now if it could say um semi-annual roadmap three thousand update so if we could put semi-annual instead of annual and then take out the yearly before update and looking to the seconder that counselor stevenson would you mind just going over uh the change in the language for the amendment again yes so in the last sentence where it says annual roadmap if it could say semi-annual and then just delete the word yearly between three thousand and update just looking to the seconder we do us our first motion okay um i have no analysis speakers list just uh calling to see if anyone else would like to speak to this ceramic thank you uh and through you i’m just hoping that the counselor will include uh that the report will include a report back on the discussion of the uh retention of 10 equity and counselors stevenson okay if it were to say so maybe at the midpoint where the semicolon is before or right after bylaw if it said um along with an update on 10 equity retention discussion so so after bylaw it would say and an update on equity retention discussion thank you counselor ramen that’ll be good that we won’t forget okay uh the clerk is going to read out the amendment to the motion civic administration be directed to report semi-annually outlining the actions taken by the dcm under the delegations under the bylaw along with an update on equity retention discussion it being noted that this report will be included as an appendix to the semi-annual roadmap three thousand update thank you and i believe that’s in your you scribe so if you can update that and i just wanted to look to the counselor if that language is good okay anyone else for the speakers list i think is that a counselor pribble all good anyone else on the speakers list counselor stevenson yeah i would just say quickly that i just really would request the support from this committee to have the semi-annual reporting given how important the affordable housing is and how um how critical it is because it’s not just for assets for the public as well and i really think the details are important thank you counselor anyone else for the speakers list i see no one so let’s call the question closing the vote the motion carries six to zero okay now back to the main motion uh as it’s on the floor um so i need a anybody who would like to anyone like to speak to the original motion of the staff recommendation last call for questions comments let’s call that too closing the vote the motion carries six to zero okay that would be the end of all the consent items so now we’re at schedule items uh so 3.1 so these are house camping amendments the administrative monetary penalty systems and business licensing by-law and we have some um added to that agenda and i believe that staff may want to speak to this mr. katolic yes through the chair the report that you have before you includes amendments to the administrative monetary penalty by-law or the amps by-law uh specifically with additional increased penalties for parking violations and sound by-law violations the report also includes several housekeeping items which focus on the business licensing by-law specific to processes definitions alignment with uh provincial legislation and as a friendly amendment we are recommending that a public participation hearing be held uh at a future caps meeting to remove the location of a adult entertainment body rub parlor uh that is currently not licensed it is currently vacant and the former applicant has not renewed the license or applied to renew the license and thank you mr. katolic do i have a mover and do i have a seconder okay so moved by council paloza seconded by councilor ramen i believe and uh looking for a speaker’s list thank you mr. presiding officer and uh appreciate the opportunity to just speak very briefly to this i’m really appreciative that staff are suggesting the friendly amendments on that license um that’s a location that’s in my ward um but frankly the community has waited a long time to see the license be removed i’m glad that we’re at the point now where we can start to have that discussion and and have a public participation meeting on it um so certainly encourage colleagues to support that and uh hopefully we can get that done uh after the ppm is is held and we can move forward with removing uh one more of those licenses from our zoning and licensing inventory and thank you deputy mary louis uh looking for more speakers last call for speakers okay let’s call the question closing the vote the motion carries six to zero okay that moves us on to section four items for direction first we have 4.1 occupant noise enforcement partner pilot project update um i don’t believe we have anyone from staff that it has anything to speak to that so i guess i’ll look for a mover in a seconder sublosa uh we’re moving that and i’m looking for a seconder Councillor stephenson on search also first normally speakers list um thank you very much i’m i feel like a guest again uh after pc yesterday i’m not a member of this committee but um this this is an issue that is very important to me it’s very important to people in my ward i get i get a lot of calls about this and i get a lot of complaints about this and i’ve i’ve also been trying to work through um the the service lending system um in my opinion and i’m going to be very frank and i’m going to be very blunt because i’m not saying anything i haven’t told you all before this is not working this this this enforcement of the noise by law is really the Achilles heel of of the enforcement system and i’m disappointed that we’re not getting uh more more on this this is just going to go through but i i want to say that at council i will be opposing this and i will i will have more to say at council but i think i think here at the committee i just want to spend a little bit of time to like express my frustration on behalf of so many of my uh so many so many of my constituents who really are frustrated and they can’t get through especially if it’s at night and they just give up so when we have these numbers of uh the very very few numbers of uh actual actual violations that is that is a real serious under reporting and i want to suggest that i i appreciate sending people out in in pairs i think that’s a good idea anyway and i appreciate um your your enforcement officers trying to ascertain from the police if there are particular dangerous issues on the premises i think that’s also something reasonable i suspect that city staff will have an easier time getting through to the um non-emergency police department through some mechanism the members of the public uh because members of the public especially at night are are not able to get through it’s very rare that people are able to get through what my first question my first question is does the city have a 24-hour um call in line that’s that’s that’s stepped to the staff through the chair as part of this pilot all occupant noise complaints are vetted through the police non-emergency line and the the reason for that is because uh we want to ensure officer safety so we want to ensure that uh a noise complaint is not also associated with any other criminal matters such as a spousal abuse that could also come in as a noise complaint but it ended up that complaint comes in in the afternoon the police were out there that morning so that is the reason that the partnership that we created with the London police that all calls were vetted through thank you i understand that that my question was does the does the other than the police department does the city have a 24-hour line that people can call into the staff through the chair uh it is not staff 24/7 it’s through our service london call center thank you um to the counselor yes um i am uh i’m going to i’m not i’m not sure what motion i want to make right now i’d like to get a little bit more information oh i can’t make a motion of course um so uh maybe i can’t even make a motion but i i do want i do want to pursue this short short of and and i do appreciate the security concern and i do appreciate the fact that um there there are spousal abuse situations there are there are violent situations we hear about them all the time um i’m also aware of the fact that a lot of the a lot of a lot of the calls um and i’m going to speak to my area i’m going to speak to the near campus area their party complaints their party complaints and i think the biggest danger at these parties i think they’re two major dangers at the parties one is you’ve you’ve got people who are drinking heavily in these parties the parties escalate and we the danger i think the real danger that the police might be concerned about is the physical safety of people in those parties particularly women okay and i think that’s a very serious concern and the other the other serious concern is of course the the the neighbors because with the neighbors with the neighbors are hearing and um this happens a lot um there there are there are large parties and it’s it’s not really easy it’s not really easy to report it so i think we need to use a different system and i appreciate the um security concerns that you’re raising about the staff but i think a more direct question could be let’s say i’m one of your municipal compliance officers and i get through service london or through some other intake line a complaint about a party and it’s been described to me as you know a lot a loud party that’s escalating a loud party that’s escalated and i’m not talking about a couple of guys sitting on the porch at two o’clock drinking beers i’m i’m talking about a large party often accompanied often accompanied like we saw last week uh with amplified music out out on the lawn uh open display of alcohol consumption um is there some way that your municipal officers could when they get that call contact the police to see if this is one of those dangerous properties on the list because i think to put that responsibility on on on the neighbor on the complainant means that you’re losing a lot of calls let’s do the chair well we also maintain a list of dangerous properties so in addition to the police vetting all the calls coming in if a call is on our dangerous property list uh we do not attend we refer that to the police if we do attend a large party and we feel that it is beyond our capacity and capability to reduce the noise or eliminate it then we’re on speed dial with the police and a good example is a recent party in the near campus neighborhood around fancia where we initially were were dispatched to that address we attended there was a couple hundred people in the street we disengaged safely referred it to the police police went in charges were laid thank you back to the counselor yes well i mean i i and i appreciate that and i and i appreciate that you can point the situations where charges were laid but when i look at these numbers and i see that there were four hundred eighty eight complaints and um eight eight monetary penalties and the four hundred three of the complaints were found to be in ballot um that really bothers me because i don’t think people are going to go to the trouble i people are not sitting around at home saying you know i have nothing to do tonight so i think i’m going to spend my time on the phone to call the call code enforcement or the police people don’t call in unless there is a disturbance and the way the current the way the current sound by law is drafted that’s actionable under the sound by law and and to say by the time our enforcement officers get there there was no noise well yeah that’s going to be the case if they get there after the party stopped but but the point i want to make here and i want to ask you about this and i’m sorry i’m taking so much time because i can’t do this at council if people call in and they’re not being responded to number one that’s not going to be reported but if they if somebody comes out later and and the noise has stopped but there was a credible report of a noise before why would you say this complaint was found to be invalid because just because by say by one one a.m the noise has stopped that doesn’t mean that at 11 p.m there wasn’t an actionable noise complaint and what what what i think you have to add to this is rather than say oh sorry it took us so long but we don’t hear anything so we’re going to find this complaint to be invalid you need to say we’re going to take the information about what you what what happened before and i don’t think a person’s going to make this up because you’re going to be getting the same you’re going to be getting that more or less the same report from from from other neighbors who are going to independently verify it so let let’s say we have a situation where you get there at 1 a.m and there’s no more noise but you’re getting credible information that there was a disturbance at 11 p.m.

do you then explain to the um to to the complainant how they can go about filing filing a complaint or do you just say well we don’t hear anything this is not a valid complaint uh thank you counselor i realized that uh i’m supposed to be going to committee members first so i’m going to limit that as your last question i will go to staff for that question but then i’ll go to the committee members and next i had i’m list was deputy mayor luis but i’m going to hopefully you’re okay with that i’m going to drop you down to the bottom of the list and get the committee members to go first so i’ll go to staff on that uh yes through the chair prior to implementing this pilot program we looked at how noise enforcement is addressed by municipalities in nterio and uh several years ago when we uh were also transitioning noise from london police to municipal compliance we actually visited municipalities that were doing noise enforcement with municipal law enforcement officers specifically guelph so i attended at night i worked the night shift at guelph i saw how noise enforcement was being implemented and yes there’s a reality that people will call in a complaint they’re being bothered at 11 o’clock we’re not going to get there five after 11 we’ll get there determining on our priority a call is coming in but if there is no noise upon arrival that that is the reality either the party has stopped or perhaps the party was so low that we don’t see any noise upon arrival uh i’ve personally worked uh night shift i’ve attended noise complaints or there’s a few individuals on a porch drinking beer listening to music and upon arrival it didn’t seem to be uh an uh valid noise complaint so we use discretion in every noise complaint that we address uh any member of the public has the right to through uh the courts to issue their own by-law offense and we haven’t seen any in in the many years that i’ve been doing this work thank you mr katola i have um counselor students and next then counselor ramen then deputy mary lewis so counselor stevenson thank you um i just want to say to staff reiterate it is a real concern with residents the noise by-law this pilot pilot project looked very positive and i really support it the 24/7 everything about it seems to make sense but i’m wondering if staff could explain to us how it works what residents can expect in terms of service because i had been told that the number that they call isn’t manned so they have to leave a message but residents don’t realize that so they think it’s not working so maybe if if we understood better how it works so that we could explain to residents that maybe if what they need to do is always leave a message but that it actually will go somewhere that somebody is answering it and we can explain to them how the process goes thank you counselor to the staff yes through the chair the the partnership that was created for this pilot was that all calls be vetted by london police so the the number is the non-emergency number and there are times that uh nobody is staffing that number for a variety of reasons and you have to leave a message and then that message is picked up and at some point that message is redirected either for the police to attend or for municipal compliance to attend so we are aware that there are some challenges with the non-emergency number and we’re attempting to with the police to resolve those thank you mr. catholic counselor stephenson thank you and is there a method do you do you get any kind of tracking system as to how many are received and what the delay times are because i i think i think really it’s an education piece for people to just trust the process leave the message and trust that it is working and if i can help in that way i’d like to thank you and through the chair we do have a tracking and in the report i notified or i i wrote that you know we attended to four hundred and eighty eight complaints those are the complaints that were dispatched directly from the police how long it takes for them to check a address it all depends on what else is happening at that time usually at night with other activities that the london police headquarters thank you and answer stevenson you’re okay with that answer okay next time the speakers list i have counselor roman thank you and through you um thank you uh i appreciate the report that’s been put in front of us for for review this evening um i think that i i agree with counselor stevenson uh i’ve heard similar concerns from residents especially around victoria day where people were trying to uh contact uh london police and the non-emergency line uh around fireworks and uh they were you know calling and it was ringing about 30 times and then i think it auto hung up after 30 rings so they would call again we’re talking about 11 o’clock at night um so obviously there needs to be an opportunity to have for their discussion we know that the police on both their emergencies and non-emergency lines are seeing increased calls so is there another option that you’ve seen out there where uh outside of service london that people can call in after hours where there’s an opportunity to again triage with an on officer from lps to make sure this isn’t a dangerous situation but that they can get those issues and those noise concerns addressed quickly to mr. katolic yes through the chair we have seen other models and uh another model would be is to expand the service of service london obviously that would be a multi-year budget request because we do not have uh 24/7 staff at the service london we do have dispatch at at bathers but that is specifically for other types of events that require dispatching and call-outs but i i want to stress the importance of triaging the calls via london police to ensure that officers are not sent to dangerous properties and to dangerous events thank you uh back to the counselor thank you and through you yes absolutely i do see the value of the triage of the call um the problem i see is that like i said residents especially on those long weekends you know i’m getting calls as a counselor and emails uh at all hours of the night because they can’t get through to anybody they’re unsure if they’ve went through the right right or wrong process they’re sometimes being told i spoke to someone just before this committee who walked me through the process by which he tried to make a complaint was sent and bounced around between service london uh the non-emergency line and the fire uh and and fire services and finally fire services uh was able to connect him and suggested that he call a counselor and have a conversation about it so i do think that the program has value in that it saves saves officer time it it allows us to uh look at those peak times that are our by our bylaw officers are out doing noise and parking enforcement and and and sunset those around each other i think that’s that’s good uh good practice but i do see that that initial call from a resident we need to find a better way uh within our systems whether it’s the police lps communication system in the non-emergency or in another system to be able to help residents be able to feel that their noise concern is being um dealt with and can be can be addressed and so maybe that’s more information maybe that’s a better uh partnership around a multi-year budget for additional communications staff for for the police i know that usually doesn’t come in that way but but something to help us so that we can see the benefit of the program uh that that we’re hoping to see thanks yes and through the chair i’m committed to always look at processes and see where the the issues are with missing links to to improve customer service thank you um counselor uh are you following up or that’s good okay next i have uh deputy mayor lewis uh thank you mr presiding officer and and through you i want to start by saying to mr katolic and our staff i think we are moving in the right direction on this i i genuinely do um but i’m going to echo some of what you’ve heard from the previous two counselors who spoke um uh and i’m going to share an example from my own own ward to start on saturday night um and i wasn’t at home i was out at a community event uh down at the prevo actually uh and within the space of about half an hour i had received two phone calls a couple of facebook messages and an email all from different residents uh all regarding uh noise complaints all of them saying they called and they could not get through to anybody i actually texted one of our deputy city managers to make sure that i had the right number uh even though i hated disturbing them on the weekend but being out at an event i i needed i needed some help in making sure i had the right information to share with the public right away um i did and and they were calling the correct number and there was no answer and the voicemail was was undoubtedly full at that point so the auto hang up was taking over um and in this case uh the reality is this was a community cultural club that was holding a very very large event where the noise could be heard from well over a kilometer away um when i got home that evening at approximately 1130 i could hear the noise on my own front porch and this was a club self of Trafalgar Street so that’s a fair distance um and the fact that none of those six five residents were able to get through to somebody to triage their complaint is a problem and i recognize fully the resource limitations that our London Police Services has right now uh and i know that they are working hard i know that we provided through the assessment growth uh business case the funding for uh new officers uh and support staff and i know that internally how they deploy those is is their matter to be dealt with not ours um but i do wonder if part of our process here is uh backward in that if if in fact our by-law officers our MLEOs are able to connect with the police uh immediately through another number i wonder if an MLEO being dispatched first and assessing the situation from a street side not even necessarily engaging with residents uh but simply a curbside presence to see if indeed there’s a situation that that may need police involvement or police triaging uh before they potentially engage might be a different way to go but i i also don’t want to uh you know put at risk the safety of our MLEOs although i recognize sometimes they respond even to property standards uh matters where they face aggressive threatening individuals so it’s it’s never a perfect system um i i don’t know if um mr katolek has any thoughts to offer um in follow-up to that again i want to stress i think we’re on the right track i i think this is the way to go i don’t think we want police having to respond to every noise complaint and i do absolutely acknowledge that there are a number of noise complaints that are just frivolous um whether it’s neighbors who don’t like each other whether it’s you know um some and and i know a couple of weeks ago i got a complaint about some teenagers in a backyard uh who were sitting around a bonfire and the music was too loud well that house is literally uh adjoining my property one property over and one property behind and i had my windows open and the kids weren’t bothering me so the music wasn’t that loud uh so i i acknowledge that sometimes these complaints are more neighborhood disputes than they are an actual by-law violation so i recognize there’s no easy answer but i do wonder if mr katolek might have any thoughts on that and just before i do that i will share with committee that i think perhaps clause c might want to consider that civic administration be directed to bring forward as part of a multi-year budget business case uh that provides funding uh to continue to improve the partnered occupant noise enforcement program so that if extra funds are required for an an improvement process uh that we’re not just limiting it to continue the process that we have today but that we if more funding is needed for an improved response bring that forward and tell us so that we can consider if if that’s worthy of funding so i’ll stop there and just see if staff have any box to offer thank you counselor that was exactly five minutes back to staff yes through the chair we looked at a number of different options and we we’ve been doing uh noise enforcement since around 2015 and the process there was that we were actually picking up the calls via our cars but we were not vetting them through the police we had our dangerous property list that we have and we keep it updated but we did not know whether we’re going to a spousal call going to a dangerous property that police may have been there that morning on a number of uh on another criminal issue and that was a a risk for our staff one of the most dangerous noise calls that you can attend to are in apartment buildings so driving past a property and rolling down your window and seeing if you hear noise that that’s one thing going up to a 12 story apartment building and hearing a large stereo on the 11th floor and not having solid escape plans and not and whether others don’t know that you’re there uh that that is a risk to staff and that’s why we doubled up on staff on all noise calls because sometimes the daily noise calls could be as dangerous as a night type noise calls so i’m committed uh if council wishes to extend this program to continue discussions with london police and look at other options because what what i’m hearing from this debate is that it’s the intake that is the issue so if if the intake if there’s a problem there and we’re not getting dispatched then that is a customer service issue that we need to address thank you mr. could hold it back to the deputy mayor you’re okay with that okay i i feel uh counselor stevenson well just i’m open to putting that amendment into see that the deputy mayor mentioned regarding um to bring through the multi-year budget process a business case regarding improvements if staff feels that would be beneficial i have two more people on the speakers list just a second um let’s take that to staff first and just get uh staff’s comments on that uh counselor roman will be seconding uh the amendment that counselor stevenson is proposing sir trusson i really do appreciate the um progress that’s being made on this but when you when you say continue the partner document noise enforcement program that’s a very specific term of art and that’s very limiting what i would like to do is um along the lines of what counselor stevenson has suggested is um add a little bit of language to that or or other intake methods because i think service london has been mentioned other other other possibilities are there um i think this is a particularly poor use most of the time that this is a particularly poor use of um a police personnel and i don’t think it’s very cost-effective and i and i and i i would like to at least given that you do have that dangerous property list and you’re constantly updating it and you can always call the police on the spot i’d like to see language in there that says um to continue the partner document noise and enforcement program or consider other approaches and and you yourself did did point out that looking around different communities there are different approaches so i would like i would like to lessen the i’d like to use the police when the police are needed and that includes when when when there’s when there’s when there’s a potential of a domestic dispute or or or weapons but i think um we we want we want to have a broader intake system and you know the thing about it is if if this is a situation like we had the other night where there are amplifiers uh where there are amplifiers on the um on the lawn and it sounds like there you can see from the cars that their cars parked all all over the place which by the way if it’s lawn parking you can make a little bit of revenue by just citing them right there um and you you mentioned that’s a good source of uh revenue um i don’t think that’s a i think that’s a party i think that’s just a boisterous party which isn’t to say they’re not dangerous because i think boisterous parties can become very dangerous especially as we get later in the evening and all those cars that are strewn around where the where the where the drivers have been heavily drinking i decided it’s time to go home so i i i do think there are uh the police issues there but i want to see and i i i appreciate what counselor louis and counselor stevenson and council roman are saying but i i would like to see the the direction and see be a little bit more open-ended so we could look at some other options thank you counselor okay we have a motion that was moved and seconded so for the clerk uh could you just repeat that language uh before anything and then uh okay the clerk is going to post what she thinks it is and then just go over the language and tell me what you think counselor stevenson um just uh tell me what you think about that language there is that correct it is what i originally said i’m wondering now if instead it could say um instead of and or just make it and and say improve the intake of the partnered occupant noise so continue and improve the intake counselor so uh the clerk has just refreshed that and uh if you just look at your scribe thank you counselor mare morgan on the speaker’s list so while you guys are looking at that i’ll have mare morgan make his comments so mare morgan um yes uh just a question uh through uh through you uh vice chair uh to our staff uh and i’ll just give a bit of a a preface for my question um i understand everything that the colleagues have said and i and i don’t necessarily disagree with with any the the points that have been made there is an important policing component to this that that we need to not ignore we know that that instances of violent crime have risen significantly in cities of our size and i want to make sure that um as we make these improvements which i’m supportive of that we’re not putting our staff at any sort of unnecessary risk without the proper training um in a situation where the police should be involved and and i’m not saying that that’s the intent that anybody is is uh giving here but i just want to make sure if i can ask through uh through you to mr katolic or or any other staff member who wants to um comment you know whether they’re you know these changes they don’t perceive that to put you know any sort of unnecessary risk for our officers because i think that there’s improvements that the lennon police service have to make to their intake as well like the improvements to the intake sure we can have a multi-year budget case but there’s obviously a dialogue here with lennon police service about the way that they staff and support uh their frontline service um communication in intakes um and so we we have to have the right balance here to get good customer service but ensure that our staff are properly and fully protected from being put in harm’s way and and i just want to ensure that we’re we’re striking that balance with this or at least there’s the flexibility to not just put all of this on the municipality but continue engagement with lps on the improvements that they need to make to support this partnership thank you mr mare to the staff through the chair uh when a noise complaint comes in through the police and uh an address pops up and uh there’s a red flag on their end we don’t even hear about it because they will send their officers so uh the dangerous property list uh that’s our list and that list has been attributed from previous by law enforcement interactions with either that property owner or a tenant on that property or a dangerous dog on that property so we we will continue to consult with the police on improving the intake line but the the response it’s the responsibility of the police to go through their system to see uh who they’re going to be sending either a police officer or a bylaw officer thank you and back to the mare no that’s good that’s very helpful i just wanted to make sure that uh that i fully understood any any implications of this particular motion um and i appreciate the answer from mr katolic on the process and again i’ll reiterate you know as as we seek to improve the intake process like that this is a this is a discussion as well with um with with lps thank you mr mare um i believe that the language is up now and the council is we’re looking at over can we just at the very end of it put or other service improvements just stand by and put that in now that should be updated in the describe now i should also ask the seconder if the language is uh good as well comes up from the seconder and the mover anybody else uh that would like to speak to us i’m so trustful this this may be a separate item um because i’d like i like what she’s done with that and i could support that at council um when when you get a um when you attend a large party and it’s in the near campus area and you you can’t tell people’s enrollment status but if you if you suspect that it’s a student uh residence um do do you have a way to or just automatically contact the student housing office because if it is students glenn matthews and his staff will will attend and that that gives you that gives you a very supplemental uh aid thank you counselor uh back to mr katolic yes through the chair glenn matthews is on speed dial however he is retiring but in situations where we know that it’s a large western party usually at the end of the year or beginning of a semester then we will definitely connect with mr matthews we will also connect if we lay charges under the nuisance bylaw with the administration to uh suggest that this is a code of conduct issue with the university and my final question is do you also because i know this is in your department as well would would you also um routinely check the um rent registration information to make sure if it appears that it’s a rental property which they usually is would you be would would you routinely check your rent registration role and also your air B&B registration role to uh to see if um the units are properly read the unit is properly registered the chair we we definitely check the uh the rental license uh that is online counselor stevenson thank you just one last question to staff in the interim if people are calling and unable to get through for whatever reason is it beneficial for them to go to service london and enter that knowing that it won’t help them in that evening but to provide the information to the city that they were unable to get through staff through the chair uh i would respectfully suggest that in the end term we continue our current process we we are always having discussions with uh london police administration and i will be putting this uh on the table very shortly sir trusson i’m sorry i just want to be responsive to that last question because i met with service london i had a very productive meeting with them last week and i and i and i explained my frustration that there’s not a noise uh enforcement thing and i explained why that was the case um and in addition to service london you have a email which is enforcement at london.ca and i often recommend that people use service london and enforcement uh and the email enforcement at london.ca just to make sure something gets through at some point so i think i think in the interim um if service london is is not equipped to add another button for noise complaints because they explained to me to my satisfaction why they could feasibly do that right right right now um at at least there could be something on there that says at the bottom for for for noise complaints also consider doing this but i think i think that that would be a service london improvement and i their service london is aware of the problem and uh they are they have undertaken to sort of try to fix it but i think they’re another party that needs to be brought into this discussion and thank you for raising that thank you counselor um i have no other speakers on the speakers list so i’m just going to call that before we call the question to the amendment so last call for speakers let’s call the question closing the vote the motion carries six to zero uh thank you and original motion i believe we had a mover and a seconder so i’m looking for speakers list to the original motion no one on the speakers list for that so let’s call the question closing the vote the motion carries six to zero okay that’s the end of that item i believe it is five almost five forty so i just like to look to committee to see if we should take a break now because i do know that we have some heavy items coming up i i do believe we have some possible delegations depending on how that goes but i’m from what i’m told they are online uh so i believe that we probably could take a maybe third or fifteen to thirty minute break counselor uh thank you and through you uh out of respect for those that are waiting to speak i’d like to power through to the rest of the committee please likely okay let’s continue on let’s go to four point two fireworks by law options report and i believe believe uh i looking to staff if you’d like to speak to uh four point two fireworks by law options report okay miss smith thank you and through the chair the report before you today is recommending that cancel holds a public participation meeting at the august 15th community and protective services committee this would allow council to receive comments on the options presented in the report today and any proposed changes to the current fireworks by-law except this what this report will then do will allow us to hold a public participation meeting following that we will then seek direction from council for any proposed changes to the fireworks by-law civic administration would then bring back that by-law by the end of the year in the last quarter of 2023 for an enactment of that changes to the fireworks by-law for january 2024 thank you miss smith oh so looking to the committee uh we have some delegates online and i would like to look to the committee to approve the delegation for now or to see if you would like to defer that for a future ppm so uh just looking to the committee just to see if we should call that delegation now i believe counselor palosa is online with her hand up so counselor palosa thank you um mr chair i would move that they’d be referred to the public the future public participation meeting they could all be heard at the same time and they’d have a secure time to speak the second if that counselor seconding that yes okay let’s call the question uh for uh deferring the ppm to a future date jeez call the question for referring deferring the delegation to a future date just for clarification was all those who sent correspondence wishing to be a delegate that they all get to go to the future ppm date clique is telling me that the first two were the only ones who request the delegation perfect thank you posing the vote the motion carries five to one okay um so i’ll just let the delegates online know that uh you have been deferred to the next ppm in august i believe august 15th um so we will see you there at august 15th thank you we look forward to deputing on august 15th okay i’m looking for a mover and a seconder for the staff recommended motion counselor ramen and a seconder the seconder with counselor stevenson put up the floor for comments questions great counselor trestle the the only thing i would suggest and this is just in the interest of having um of very full information uh when you when you when you put out your august staff report is um to include a little bit more information about what other cities are doing but even even more importantly what the costs are of the of the alternatives because while you did mention drones and light shows you mentioned the costs for the drones but you didn’t mention the costs for the light shows and just just by referring to the hide park business association we we have a people who are working on this issue have a good sense how much that is but i think that you should officially confirm confirm that and um i don’t think this can be in the um motion uh it would be great if people go out to the to the bia uh on fest to see to see what one of these uh laser shows look like because i went to the one last year and it was just absolutely breathtaking it was fantastic i think people will really enjoy it and that’s not part of the motion but i i do think you should try to get that additional information and that doesn’t need an amendment can counselor trust so i got counselor palosa next palosa yeah sorry just hitting lots of buttons trying to get there we go um thank you uh to staff this report it’s an ongoing issue it has been since i joined council very mindful of potential next steps that we take realizing it’s always a matter of enforcement we can set out what we want but if staff can’t find the issue or can’t get there in time as we’ve always heard with not noise bylaws it really does make it inefficient um also been following what brampton’s doing as they also celebrate dawali and it’s a city run and sponsored events looking forward to what diversity inclusion we can have in the city of london realizing some of that might have a multi-year budget impact or be a pilot project of if the city hosts some of those fireworks like we do for Canada Day some opportunities as well in there for getting to know about other cultures that are thriving within our city um i also say that there has been a drone light show done before in london it was hosted a couple years ago at the south london canada celebrations went very well um but people tend to still enjoy fireworks and i recognize that as if they don’t clean up we find the garbage in the parks in the casings from the fireworks as well that staff need to then go up and clean up for the parks are safe for everyone who wants to use them a question through you um to staff um or i guess two comments two questions is does the city traditionally lay charges uh against private residences um like in the past and i’ve had questions from residents when they see fireworks going off if it’s private ones we’ll say at a golf course or whatnot of how would they find out if they actually had a permit to stop those fireworks you know to find that information without having to ask their word counselor or staff to know what’s happening in their community is there a place in the city’s website that’s easily accessible to help people know who has permits and what to expect to be set off in their neighborhoods thank you thank you counselor palosa to the staff thank you and through the chair i’ll answer uh number two and then i’ll turn to mr atollic for the question about if we’ve um charged anybody for fireworks and noise complaints um in 2022 we had 14 permitted fireworks displays um four of those were for canada today uh so you raise a really good question about how we don’t publicly share on social media and on our city website the dates and the times of those displayed fireworks so that is one of the enhancements we can do now and we will do for our future fireworks bylaw for next year thank you mr smith back to counselor palosa i was waiting for an answer for mr katolic about uh what kind of charges if the city lays if if we do get there in time to find people in the dark apologies mr katolic yes through the chair there is an app for the sound bylaw and after tonight it’ll be higher at 250 dollars that there is also an app under the fireworks bylaw of 175 dollars we have not laid any charges we have responded to those noise complaints but the reality of the complaint is it comes in it’s very typical i live at this address i’m hearing fireworks it’s somewhere around my house we try to find it throughout the neighborhood throughout the kilometer to kilometer distance where we are successful we find casings there’s no evidence of like the people are gone other situations from uh this past May 24 we attend the park the folks see us driving into the park not and they scatter and we’re not chasing obviously so that’s that’s the reality of fireworks enforcement thank you mr katolic counselor palosa thank you and i know part of the discussion was from the public and would we just ban the sale of fireworks within the city realizing we have neighboring municipalities ripped to our geographical borders i’m sure those fire works vendors would just move to the borders and people would purchase their wares there and bring them back into the city so very mindful of that reality as well and looking forward to hearing my colleagues comments tonight thank you counselor palosa i got deputy mayor louis next on the list thank you mr presiding officer and uh i’m just i’m going to share a few thoughts uh but i’m going to start with a question through to our staff in terms of the potential of restricting to only specifically canada day and and victoria day and not as we have some leeway in our bylaw right now for a a day prior to uh canada day when it falls in the middle of the week um and what the thought process is around that i’m mindful of the fact that victoria day always falls on a monday and uh the majority of the complaints that i’ve heard from residents come on sunday night because people want to do their fireworks displays on sunday because on monday night they want to put the kids to bed because it’s school the next day um and sometimes that reality happens on canada day two depending on where the calendar falls so i’m wondering if staff could comment first of all on on why there would not be consideration for um the closest weekend evening to the holiday as opposed to the holiday itself uh recognizing that we still have people who struggle to follow an a day garbage pickup calendar that that could cause some confusion but whether or not there was consideration given to that thank you miss miss miss so through the chair i’ll start that part of it is so permitted at display fireworks are based on a permit that goes through the fire chief so those permitted display fireworks can happen at any time if permitted and approved so probably what you’re asking for is the details around the consumer backyard fireworks and for the rationale on the days i’m going to turn it over i have on the line uh deputy matt heptich he’s the deputy chief of fire inspection and education where this by-off falls thank you through the chair uh the the days were the concerns we had with with with regards to the amount of time that fireworks were being discharged and the the extra dates and then the time gaps um between there uh so a saturday proceeding in canada day where canada day falls on a monday um there are a lot of concerns that were brought forward to us uh with regards to the amount of time um that fireworks were being discharged so the were concerns were made that um it was an excessive amount of time that we permitted fireworks to be discharged so that was taken into consideration for that particular item and thank you back to the deputy there thank you uh mr presiding officer um so i’m just going to um uh share some comments then and i’m going to pick up where counselor plows a left-off um just like her i’ve been listening to this conversation for five years now um and i hope after we have this ppm in august that we reach a decision and stop talking about it i think there are frankly a lot bigger issues in our city that we need to be dealing with and and i’m i’m really i will admit frustrated by the revolving uh uh door of this issue coming back and coming back and coming back and i think counselor plows a outlined uh some of the real challenges very well uh we have approximately 4 000 kilometers of roadway in this city we have and the deputy city manager miss smith will correct me if i’ve got the number wrong but i think it’s approximately 400 public park spaces 120 plus school yards uh and that doesn’t even start to factor in vacant lots or uh golf courses as we heard counselor plows a mention um the reality is enforcement is never going to be able to respond to these in a manner that is going to satisfy every complaint as mr katolek pointed out by the time they are able to identify some sites it’s usually just casings the people are gone um because these consumer fireworks uh they’re not free they have a cost and so the show is often five or ten minutes and they’ve been expended the event is over and by law is still 15 minutes away uh because they are not running red lights to respond to a fireworks complaint they are following the rules of the road and and by the time they get their folks are long gone um so i think we have to be practical about enforcement and i also and by the way i want to say as an aside i’m really glad the staff are uh including dewali in in uh recommendation a i think that’s really important to be more sensitive to the fact that other cultures uh enjoy using fireworks it’s just not an north american tradition i saw a reference to the chinese new year in the report as well um and so certainly uh those organized events and advertising those organized events through our city website i think is a is a great thing because for all the requests we get to ban them i i want to be really really clear here and i was speaking to counselor hilly earlier this afternoon he said the last canada day fireworks in summer side had about 65 to 6800 people attend uh the last time we had a fireworks display for canada day uh with the east london optimus club uh we had in excess of 10 000 residents attending they filled the walmart parking lot they were in the school parking lot they were on the field the school fields they filled the field beside argylerena um it was a tremendous number of people who attended so make no mistake a lot of londoners enjoy these and and they may not be everybody’s cup of tea um but the majority of residents in my ward aren’t interested in seeing a ban and they’re actually tired of of hearing this issue come up year after year after year so um i’m just letting colleagues know ahead of time i i’m not going to be supportive of a total ban um i am going to uh listen to ideas around sales and uh uh how we limit those sales uh you know in the staff report option a recommends five days prior to an allowed event but as counselor plows pointed out um a resident in argyle could easily get out to doorchester and get them in in uh the municipality of tem center uh and then come back here and and fire them off and i know tem centers you know happily take the um the business license fee for a vendor to sell them out there um but in this day and age they can be ordered online and delivered to your front door so if uh you think the banning the sales is is going to stop consumer fireworks displays i i think that you’re you know respectfully not factoring in all of the realities of of today and online stores and and other municipality services i think we have to be uh understanding in the broader context so um as i said i i think option a uh that staff are suggesting is is something that i could possibly get to i’m not supportive of pursuing a ban so um i hope when we get to the point of making a decision on this um that however the outcome is it’s a decision that we let stand and that we’re not talking about this again at this time next year thank you i got counselor chroso next i don’t want to get thank you through the chair i don’t want to get too far into debating this because we’ll do that in august um one question i have is um would it be possible to do this at sppc instead of this committee given given my prediction that many many visiting counselors maybe maybe the entire council will want to attend this and that’s something i’ll just leave with the clerk but one of the problems i think we have is the induced demand through through through through the easy availability where you see like these are available on many many blocks and furthermore you don’t have to wait until june 24th the displays are already out the ad for these huge billboards are are already out and i do i think it’s true that people will be able to go outside of london to purchase them but but this will stop a lot of the impulse purchases because when you get into the last couple of days you’ve got people going down the street they’re not even thinking about it they see these huge huge displays with the come ons and the balloons and the boom and everything and uh oh yeah let’s get some fireworks so i i think i think it will i think it will um help in terms of uh depressing the demand and don’t forget we went through this entire discussion many years ago in a different level of government with cigarettes and i think i think uh there’s no doubt that the fact that you don’t have the cigarette displays all over the place uh geared towards children uh has has cut down people’s ability to get cigarettes and if you want to get cigarettes you can get cigarettes we had the same discussion about pesticides but then the province came in and sort of uh provincialized it but i think i think that these concerns about yes people people can go to uh doorchester to buy their firecrackers it’s it’s true but it’s going to be less convenient and people really will have to think about it ahead of time and i think i’m going to stop there because i don’t want to get too far into the debate but these are legitimate these are these enforcement questions are very legitimate and it might be useful at some point to get to get a report from licensing just to get a sense of how many of these stalls there there are around the city and where they’re located and should we decide to uh allow the backyard fireworks to continue um i think we have to give some serious consideration to the conduct of these um stalls in terms of in terms of how they induce induce the demand in terms of the Diwali and chinese new year um i think the the best the best way to deal with that would be you can get a permit like anybody else on any other um day i i think extending the days for consumer fireworks um might not be a great idea if the idea is to limit these and not not expand them because i think once once you do one once you do one religion you’re going to have other others wanting wanting to wanting to come in and even even if you even if you do not allow the backyard fireworks on different days uh if the permitting regime is still there um group groups can still go in for for permits so i think this discussion on August 15th is going to be very good and uh i just i i know certainly many many of us who are guests on this committee will want to attend so i’m wondering if the clerk might consider putting out to the SPPC that’s uh all i have to say for tonight thank you counselor next i have on the list council ramen and then counselor palosa thank you and through you um so i welcome the conversation on the 15th and look forward to hearing more from residents about their concerns on this matter um i just had some questions one uh to counselor trusses point i do think it would be helpful to get an idea from permits of uh the business permits associated with fireworks sales in the city right now to uh to deputy mayor lewis’s point around doorchester yeah they’ll just go to alderton as well um and you know uh it’s funny because i’ve i can see the fireworks that that happened in alderton from my house so um i’m sure we’re gonna you know um promote people going there if we we ban them all right outright um so so yes i i’m i’m concerned about that as well when it comes to the decision as to which uh holidays and festivals to allow fireworks just wondering how we will take a look at that because uh it’s volleys mentioned here a number of times this year falls on sunday in november um you know one thing to consider is that there are other cultures that have fireworks displays associated with their cultures that are not day festivals that are week-long festivals in some cases um so i’m just wondering what kind of uh how how we’ll consider that maybe it’s not for today maybe that’s more of a discussion later on um but i was thinking uh through that as well um and then when it comes to enforcement specifically around uh the that window of time where establishments can sell them um i know again i’ve received complaints of places that are open or uh being able to buy them at your grocery store or your um or your convenience store down the street how does that uh how how does enforcement deal with that and um and do we have the resources to do that effectively thank you counselor i believe that’s for miss smith and mr katolic i believe mr katolic first then yes through the chair we definitely are resourced to respond to those complaints and have and have charged retailers for selling uh earlier or after the approved dates and certainly for the august report we can provide a list of seasonal sales related to fireworks because they are licensed counselor ramen thank you um and just to follow up on that so that’s like a a can i guess complaint driven process as well someone would have to go into an establishment where they sell fireworks and say this place is still selling them it’s not a proactive thing that we do to go out and and seek that information through the chair it’s both complaint and proactive because we do send staff out to hand out these pamphlets that they’re suggested to hand out to their clients that are purchasing the fireworks which indicate when they can and can’t release them thank you and do we have any comparison in terms of places that have banned fireworks um on staff time associated with enforcement around the ban or if they’re seeing any any other patterns or trends that with perhaps associated costs that that can also be shared mr thank you and through the chair i’ll start and then deputy heptich we um we were aware of branpton branford we’ve been following the news and we had uh the deputy chief reach out to his colleague there understanding that the very first time was victoria day and they will have much better information by canada day but he can speak to what he heard from that we also through one of the added items i learned uh i believe it was uh caladin that also has a municipal ban on backyard or consumer fireworks so we will definitely follow up with our colleagues there to better understand that because part of the bylaw when it comes back depending on uh the direction council uh goes with this will include enhanced enforcement and education uh regarding that so it’s important to understand what that means resource wise from our colleagues so deputy chief heptich i’m not sure if you have some something additional to add thank you and through the chair when i reached out to the branpton fire department they indicated they had staffing on over the same weekend over the long weekend for victoria day uh day two had municipal law enforcement and uh fire inspectors out going around the city what i did note is they experienced the same type of enforcement concerns that we have um by the time they arrived um in the open areas the parks um etc they too found only shell casings and did not um did not find the people who were discharging those fireworks um they also stated they they still had people uh discharging fireworks and they went out like we’ve discussed already um to other neighboring municipalities and purchased their fireworks there came back to branpton and discharged the fireworks despite having that ban uh thank you back to the counselor i think that’s all my questions at this time and uh i too encourage people to go to the Hyde park pond fest this weekend and uh observe the lecho thank you thank you counselor next on the speaker’s list counselor palosa uh thank you for recognizing me again uh just uh two things the first follow up would be through to through you to mr katolek those pamphlets that you supply and just briefly had held up um you mentioned we give them two suppliers and suggest that they hand them out to consumers wondering if there’s anything we could do regulations wise um requiring the vendor to provide them to the consumer absolutely the consumer may or may not read them and may or may not follow the rules outlined within it but can we require them to actually give one per purchase mr katolek through the chair we could do that administratively through administrative regulations and i’ll give that serious consideration uh thank you and my other one is uh a follow-up to a couple of colleagues who had mentioned it um i know sometimes you look at expanding the fireworks and it might be contrary to what we think about doing for those days we currently allow but i will just highlight um as we mentioned other cultures and duality and other people that celebrate right now if we’re just talking about victoria day and canada day those are two holidays built built on colonialism that uh we’re highlighting celebrating and that’s not a celebration for everyone in our community and my concern is if we start just regulating it to those two it is um not in alignment with diversity and inclusion thank you thank you for your comments counselor um that is that has exhausted my speaker’s list do i have any other uh committee members or visiting counselors that would like to speak mr hockens yeah thank you mr proff deciding chair for recognizing me i just uh want to uh say that i’m really looking forward to the public participation meeting on august the 15th and uh i uh maybe do have a quick question through you to uh staff around these operators that set up shop on our roads to sell fireworks i have noticed from time to time that they do display their fireworks as well on the side of the road and i’m just wondering if if that’s allowed staff through the chair we partner with our fire prevention officers proactively uh and reactively to ensure they’re licensed uh we have had a situations where fire prevention uh had to deal with uh display of fireworks and sunlight and have addressed those situations thank you and counselor hockens yeah it’s good to know that uh we are addressing those um concerns and again looking forward to the public participation meeting thank you counselor hockens um anyone else for the speakers list okay let’s call the question closing the vote the motion carries six to zero okay that leaves us with uh 4.3 encampment response update but i do believe that that will probably be a hefty discussion um and then we have the confidential items after so i’m looking to committee again to take a 30-minute break it’s like i have consensus on that right someone who wants to move can we do 20 okay mover counselor perble seconder counselor stevenson hand vote that’s carried uh we will be back in 20 minutes that’s 6 30 okay welcome back uh we will be resuming this meeting so we are on 4.3 the encampment response update i believe staff has a report so i will start it with mr dickens thank you chair and through you to committee um we recognize that uh this report uh was included on the added agenda so perhaps it’s created limited amount of time for committee to thoroughly review um the table focus that’s dedicated to this response in the community is quite dynamic and they’ve been coming up with many ideas and crafting um numerous plans uh with related budgets for a wide range of responses and we needed the additional time to bring forward uh what you see before you today is a bit of a tangent tangible response i would like to acknowledge uh i’m joined by members of my team that have been participating in the table discussions and joining in the gallery this evening are the co-chairs of the encampment response table uh shantel mcdonald and greg nash the report before you gives a glimpse of the dire straits that are uh that are encampments in our community currently as well as an overview on the role and efforts of the city’s coordinated informed response team the focus discussions of those participating in the acute response and the proposed scope of the work initially and acknowledgement that this response and these plans and this work in the community will evolve and it will evolve not just to provide more and continuously improved services to supporting encampments but also this will begin to align with the whole of community system response work and link into the strategy and accountability table where members of council will begin to receive updates through our monthly SPPC reports and with that i’d be happy to entertain any questions from committee thank you thank you mr dickens uh i think first we should start to see if we have a mover to put the staff recommendation and a seconder i’ll receive this move in or thank you well i potentially would like to move something other than this in that we are we’re just looking at doing a public participation meeting for fireworks and i think i’m wondering why we aren’t having a public participation meeting for encampment strategies because it’s a deep deep concern in the public and there’s a lot here there’s a lot of decisions to make and um i i would like to put the motion forward that we have a public participation meeting and i’d like staff’s input on that i will go to mr dickens uh thank you so what’s before you is an immediate response we’ve been trying to um discern what is possible to support the acute and significant health and safety concerns related to encampments in the next 30 60 and 90 days this is not the what will become the community strategy on encampments that will happen through the whole of community system response work that will be happening happening in the next 90 to 120 days this here is focused primarily on uh the rising risks and desperation that exists in encampments and it’s focused solely on the health and safety of those individuals in encampments at this time there will be a process which will include engagement with those currently in encampments those serving folks in encampments the business community much like we’ve launched with the hubs plan looking at using a resource to help us in those efforts like many other communities in Ontario have done to shape an actual community encampment strategy this is uh is separate and apart from that thank you mr dickens uh counselor stephenson thank you and i’d like to understand why there is such an immediate need now when like this has been going on for a long time and we ended the winter response at the end of march and things have been going on and all of a sudden now there’s no time for a public participation meeting i think this is really important and i understand the dire need but there are many many dire needs and this i’d like to understand why we can’t wait a month until we have a public participation meeting mr dickens uh through you chair thank you for that the uh issue has always been uh significant and yes the temporary measures uh funded through the temporary funding of the winter response did come to an end in encampments uh we’re challenging prior to the winter response significantly more challenging since then uh why uh i guess what i’m i’m trying to articulate is that uh there will be an encampment strategy and a community encampment strategy uh this here is um us listening to frontline workers that um have been sharing with us some pretty significantly traumatizing events in encampments um be it from primary health concerns uh loss of life um significant violence and increase in unpredictable behavior that the community is uh quite organized and uh quite articulate in describing why we need to take additional measures right now we have the community uh the city have been taking many measures up until this point to try and uh keep pace with the situations and encampments uh this is an attempt to try and go above and beyond that it’s also an acknowledgement of the community that what they’ve been trying to do what we’ve all been trying to do uh has not achieved the outcomes and the response that we had hoped to get and therefore they’re actually tabling new ideas of being more coordinated with scheduling with mapping with services uh overlapping multidisciplinary approaches to support people in an encampment so i think that’s what’s different now than prior thank you mr.

Dickens counselor Stevenson thank you the issue that i have is that there is the time for the tables to meet and talk and come up with solutions but there’s no time for counsel or for the public so even though it was an urgent dire need there’s been the time for the tables to meet and spend the due time and care to come up with this the public deserves equal treatment and their elected officials deserve equal treatment and i would say what’s written in here is um you know violence cutie mental health and physical health issues overdoses in the toxicity of street substances fire state feeding issues threats to staff and volunteers hopelessness and desperation and yet what we’re meeting the need with is three meals water washrooms showers and i’m not diminishing the need for those things but this is not addressing the issues of violence mental health overdoses fire safety hopelessness the encampments are incredibly incredibly unsafe not just for the people there but for the surrounding communities and we’ve gone from saying we’re moving away from shelters and people deserve homes and not tiny homes to somehow supporting them in encampments and the people have a lot to say about this they really do and what is here deserves the do thoughtful care of the public in my opinion and there is concern in the public around their lack of involvement in this there are concerns about where the hubs are going to go are they going to get any notice the transition from 403 Thompson from affordable housing to highly supportive housing happened very very quickly there was a phone call made from the city looking to rent out the location that was cycle path on Richmond street whether that there’s a nervousness well there’s a rumor then i’ll put it that way but i had confirmed it um but there’s a nervousness about what’s happening and are they going to know i’ve had several emails today people are very nervous and so these encampments we’ve got phase one phase two we’ve got a a full-on strategy i think we get to check in with the public around whether they want that or not because they want housing and permanent solutions here and we’re focusing this is a lot of money what’s coming before us here is six weeks that’s going to cost uh three hundred thousand dollars fifty thousand dollars a week we’re giving out four thousand water bottles a week um and and a lot of money and garbage removal and stuff i i would like to put forward a motion that we do a public participation meeting i don’t know if anyone’s willing to second that thank you counselor looking for a seconder to the motion for a public participation meeting actually do you have a time frame would you like when you’d like to have that come back are we if we are we able to do two in one we could do it at the august meeting or potentially at the sppc i’m not sure either why some things come through sppc and them some things through caps i’m looking for a seconder okay um we’ll hold that and i do have a speaker’s list so let’s go to counselor ramen and then counselor pribble so sure to chair to the staff um i do agree in principle this my fellow counselor that we need a different kind of approach but uh the problem is that we are really in crisis and you know the encampments i was in last seven days three of them by temps river uh of wellington downtown and also east of adlade they are really growing rapidly overnight and uh i do love the theory or strategy of counsel stillinson the only problem i have that we are going to delay and the problem is i do have also questions you know when i look at the costs and what we are getting for so i certainly i don’t think i don’t want to discuss it now because that would be a pro lengthy conversation but uh ppm is great for the long-term strategy but it’s not going to resolve the situations that we have there right now and those people they need food they need the drinks they need the washrooms and they need that so i’m going to actually put this back before uh before anyone or including myself seconds it back to the staff if they can tell me in terms of um how they would see it in terms of addressing the crisis right now but keeping in mind the bigger picture because i do agree as well that if we are talking about fireworks ppm this is a much bigger issue and there are a lot of people that they feel that are not being heard thank you thank you counsel pribble i actually had counsel ramen next on the list um but i will allow staff to answer your question but just one uh one response and then i’m going to be going to counsel ramen uh misliving standard thank you mr chair so this is exactly what we’re trying to do address a very immediate health and safety concern while we are moving forward with the implementation work on the system all of us want to see in place that is the system we are actively engaging on we’re beginning those consultations this week but this report is addressing the immediate health and safety what mr dickens tried to indicate is and which is why it’s at this committee as we move forward with the longer term work of what encampments look like in our community and how they fit into the broader system that is the work that will come in through the sppc work as part of the whole of community response so trying to align these but right now this report is trying to address address a very immediate health and safety concern for the folks that are in the encampments and those that serve them thank you mrs. Livingston uh counselor ramen thank you and through you i will not be seconding the motion and uh to miss Livingston’s point as well um there are strategy there are opportunities for the public to uh provide their input right now uh with the survey online but also i know tomorrow night i’m planning to attend uh the session at the Canadian Aquatic Center where i’m hoping to hear from constituents their thoughts and concerns on these on on these issues but what we have in front of us is a pressing need it is one that i’m very grateful for our staff bringing this to us it can’t be easy to continue to come back in front of this committee and ask for additional resources on a strategy and that is still in development on um next steps that are still being thought through but also prioritizing first and foremost how we get people their basic necessities at this point so uh you have my support on on moving this forward i’m happy to put uh if anything needs to be put forward on this motion i’m happy to do that i do have some questions around the allotment just want to uh fully understand i know there’s a table that’s that’s behind this work um and then there’s that chart below that explains everybody that’s funded um but i know i’m just wondering if when it’s referencing the community partners and the first part of the table if that is a reference exactly to those those partners that are part of the table that are already there it just it’s just unclear to me if let’s say you know arcade is receiving any funding because i can’t see it can like clearly delineated to me as to to who those partners are so looking for more of that information um because i do know that the public is very interested in exactly who is getting those funds um to be able to provide those basic needs that we have to address right now at this critical moment thank you thank you counselor i would staff like to speak to that Mr Dickens thank you chair and through you so from the administrative standpoint we are looking to make amendments to existing contracts through London Cares and CMHA to provide additional services the existing drop-in staff supports the extension of four weeks that will actually flow through uh London Cares to the Arc as they are still operating those drop-in spaces this will extend it by another month so and in that table you’ll note we are expanding or adding to the current city garbage collection team dedicated to CIR from increased coverage and servicing of garbage collection and then we have a five-month period where we will continue to provide the CIR by-law services for the an additional five months as well thank you mr Dickens counselor yeah thank you for that additional information i do find that helpful um i think when it comes to the the public and their understanding of what’s going on you know i’m grateful for our media partners that i think are doing a really good job of making sure that these issues are covered um but i do hear you know some desire for more information and i think that wolf will hear that as well coming out of some of the consultations i know that’s part of the ongoing strategy is to continue to update the public and have that opportunity for that conversation but personally i want to share that i don’t know that a public participation meeting is actually the place to do it i think that these smaller opportunities to have the discussions within our community centers over that that one hour time period where we’re we’re we’re engaging in here’s what what we’re rolling out and here’s what we’re thinking and here are the surveys i think that at this time that’s that’s a warranted approach as things continue along and we continue to develop plans i think there’s more opportunity to share more with the public and and i know that i’ll be continuing to include this topic in upcoming meetings that i’m doing with my award as well thank you thank you counselor i will go to counselor Stevenson thank you i’m wondering if anyone would be willing to second a motion that just adds to this maybe f that we do have a public participation meeting in advance of or in conjunction with the next phase of this encampment strategy it truly is a huge issue and it needs more than just three questions on a survey around where they would like to or not have the hubs we have already had in the short phase that i’ve been in as counselor an additional women shelter put on Dundas street against the core area action plan without due consultation now and and people are concerned they are concerned that where we had locations for winter response before that things are just going to show up without consultation and they and they write they they are right to be concerned in here it says that under phase two the considerations for the depose will be based on two factors where encampments are located and where resources are most needed there’s nothing in there that considers the community or the businesses and it also says that the it refers to social depots which are going to be temporary service depots which are going to be temporary and then urban depots which are going to be utilizing it says a potential urban location will look to utilize existing agency support locations and will be confirmed as part of the ongoing work to support the basic needs of those encampments we already have addressed in the core area action plan a potential over saturation of social services in the core area which was not addressed instead an 88 page help in hard times booklet was updated and that was ticked off as completed in the core area action plan and it’s just it’s simply not acceptable to continue to talk about supporting the core area and then not allow the people a voice or allow the people’s elected representative a voice because i have still not yet been allowed to attend any part of this health and homeless summit there have been several meetings of which other people are allowed to be part of that process and we are not and is the public we are not so i’m asking at the very least that we put a public participation meeting where there is an opportunity for the people to have a say on this so that you guys can take that into consideration as we move forward so should do i have a second thank you counselor um i guess before we go to staff for anything let’s see if you do have a seconder okay uh we don’t have a seconder yes of yet so i do have uh someone on the speakers list that’s counselor scribble through the chair to the staff uh in our meetings in the in the summit meetings for mental health and homelessness did we are we planning actually part public participation meeting in some stage or were we thinking of it or were we kind of going to roll it out on our own together with the agencies and partners uh miss Livingston through you mr chair the uh work that’s happening right now is to engage with the community through a variety of mechanisms including the community uh meetings that are being held this week the get involved survey standing up the business reference table which is part of their implementation framework so they can be consulted directly standing up the development reference table that’s all happening right now so that the feedback around uh the work of the hubs can be fed into the hub implementation table so that as they’re developed the plan in real time they have that feedback and input uh where hubs can be located where they shouldn’t be located how they can be good neighbors all of that can go right into the hub plan all of that will come forward to counsel along with the themed overview of all of the feedback so you would see the recommended criteria the how the functions will be delivered along with that feedback that’s the that’s the approach that we have undertaken at this time because we would uh pending counsel’s decisions at that meeting the July 19th meeting uh and then subsequently the following week we would then like to be able to move to an expression of interest process so we can actually get hubs stood up this year that’s why we’re moving so the doing this very intensive engagement through a variety of mechanisms at the front end while the plan is being developed uh is what um we believe will bring a much stronger plan to counsel so you’ve all of that at the front end versus creating a plan and then hearing about what people think about it that’s what’s in place at the moment thank you miss Livingston i’m going to pass the chair off to counselor ramen because i’d like to make some comments i’m the next on the speaker’s list and then deputy mayor lewis uh thank you i’ll confirm i have the chair uh and i recognize the counselor for rarer uh is next on speaker’s list and then deputy mayor lewis thank you counselor ramen i just wanted to make some quick some comments uh based off uh from what equating miss Livingston um we do have the open houses occurring right now i believe the first session was yesterday tomorrow and we also have the get involved site is open to taking in public comments as well so just because i do know this is a very large amount of work that staff is undertaking right now i don’t necessarily want to be adding um extra duties to them especially when we are in the current process of bringing in public input as it is so um i wouldn’t necessarily i would not be supporting a public participation meeting at this present time just because of what we have in place right now so i just wanted to make those comments and i’ll give it back to counselor ramen thank you i pass the chair back to you recognizing deputy mayor lewis is next on the list thank you counselor ramen deputy mayor lewis thank you so i have a few thoughts to share um and hopefully help people reach some decision points here um i don’t disagree that there has to be an opportunity for the public to weigh in on the longer term encampment strategy and i appreciate hearing uh that that is going to be part of the next phase um i i will actually have a question about this report uh after we deal with uh what’s being discussed right now but um i hear the concerns that Lincoln you need to at the same time uh we have um some growing needs even in the city it’s not just that the problem has always been there um the problem is growing it’s not even just staying flat um and so i understand why staff are coming forward in the short term asking for some more resources and and and to the point it’s not easy to have to keep coming back um and asking for more resources um i did hear um you know that ultimately uh some of this funding will throw flow through through lending cares i may follow up with some more questions on that later but i i think what we have to keep in mind as uh we’ve heard miss Livingston say several times with the whole of community response we’re we are building a bridge as we walk across it and we don’t have the full blueprint here yet um but we do have a crisis on our streets and i think when we’re we’re talking about uh some of the things that they were highlighted um the increased threats of violence to outreach workers um the uh the just general desperation out there some of this emergency resource direction in terms of not just food and water but providing opportunities that schedule times for access to showers and other things i mean i think it’s amazing how much dignity you can give a human being back uh by letting them have a shower and put on some clean clothes um and maybe walk away with a bottle of water in a sandwich it’s not solving the it’s not solving the fact that they’re homeless it is not solving the fact that they may be dealing with an addiction or a mental health issue um but i would argue that it probably is de-escalating them from a strained and and potentially violent situation uh to a more uh cordial and and at least willing to interact with our outreach workers situation so i also understand the um desire to see some fiscal oversight and and some financial responsibility on these things um i i know that these are flow-through agreements i think in the future if these have to happen it would be great if we had them broke down a little bit more but that’s a future thing that’s not a today thing um for me where the fiscal responsibility comes in is how much are we going to save with this investment right now in terms of emergency service responses uh how many calls are we going to take off the police 911 call list or off the EMS call list because we’ve treated people with a little bit of dignity and de-escalated at least in the moment a situation rather than them potentially having a violent um interaction with somebody so i i see both sides of the concern i i do think it’s absolutely necessary uh that the public have an opportunity to weigh in on the longer-term encampment strategy um i suspect uh and people have referenced the open houses that we’re having this week on the community hubs um i suspect that we’re going to hear quite a bit about encampments at those open houses we’re not just going to hear about what people think about what the hubs should or shouldn’t look like where they where as appropriate or inappropriate for them to be located i think we’re gonna get a lot of other feedback as well uh and i know that uh staff involved will be collecting that uh and i’ll be attending the one in at east lions just as counselor roman is returning the one at the is attending the one at the aquatic center and we’ll be listening to so i and i hope that every single member of council attends at least one of these sessions because uh to counselor stevenson’s original original point i think it cannot be underscored enough that there is a lot of nervousness and a lot of questions out there with the general public and i know that we are trying to respond quickly and i know uh that when we talk about getting these community hubs up and running i’m not sure if if colleagues and and i guarantee i don’t mean this disrespectfully i guarantee the members of the public do not understand what a tremendously heavy undertaking this is to start with some summits at the end of last year and envision having having the first hubs open before this calendar year is out it’s for for government this is moving at light speed um it really is i i know mr katolics in the back row when i first came to council um i i approached him about uh introducing a municipal licensing bylaw and tow trucks and i know that that’s not even close to the same level of urgency here that took three years for just a business licensing bylaw we’re we’re talking about reinventing a system response with 70 different community agency partners uh as well as trying to take into consideration the public’s feelings and uh the lived experience feelings in addition to those frontline workers and we’re trying to make that all work in an incredibly short period of time and i would argue that we now is not the time to hit pause and now is the time to keep moving ahead because and we’re going to make some mistakes folks make no mistake about that there are going to be some parts of the system that aren’t going to work out perfectly and in a year we’re going to be talking about how we we adjust those and and what didn’t work um but we’ve got to find a way forward right now so i hope that colleagues will support in the short term this investment um but i really think um as we are thinking about the longer term plan we do have to think about giving the public an opportunity to weigh in on the encampment response just as we have with the and are doing this week with the uh community hubs response so um i’m going to stop it there for now and see if we actually uh get some discussion going around um some more pieces of the report like i said i do have a couple questions on that but i’m going to hand it back over to committee to see where the discussion goes before i ask those questions thank you deputy mayor uh have counselor trusso next on the list well i’ll be i’ll be attending um i’ll be attending the the meeting tomorrow night at the aquatic center um with counselor ramen it’s right on the border between our two towards and i’ve been getting a lot of questions that i can’t answer as you know i i i often send you um referrals from constituents whose questions i can’t answer and i hope to learn a lot at that meeting um tomorrow and uh this report is helpful and in and in particular this this list is helpful one thing that i’ve had a concern about which i think is addressed here and i i i’m pretty sure it’s addressed here is i’m concerned about food security because i think i think um to the extent that we can continue the um programs that provide um meals for people i think that doesn’t solve the problem but i think it gets it keeps the it keeps the intensity uh from getting worse and i think i think if people are uh used used to being able to get you know food from someplace and that’s that’s cut off it people are going to be angry people are going to do other things in order to feed themselves and um i just i just i just i’m glad i’m glad to see that there is support so i’m here for the existing drop-in staff staff supports and i’m i’m just wondering if this is enough i believe that was a question from council trust us so i’ll take it back to mr dickens uh thank you chair and through you um the group that has been designing what we can do immediately has um certainly echo with those sentiments that the level of desperation and hopelessness does revolve around in in many ways um people being hungry uh not having enough access to to foods um this is a plan to make sure that we are providing that sustenance to people uh where they’re at supporting them certainly the access to uh drinking water and that’s why you see in the report we are starting uh this evolving process by trying to take a human rights perspective and really looking at some of those core foundational human rights approach to homelessness in canada as it relates to encampments and and so those social supports the health and wellness supports having the home bus be a part of the service depots access to clean drinking water hygiene station so people can use the the washroom facility uh with dignity those things help uh ease that pressure and ease that sense of hopelessness isn’t enough the report outlines that we need to start merging into the whole of community system response right now we are desperately trying to keep workers safe to keep people in encampment safe to ease the tension between neighbors and encampers uh to try and help the community but we’re operating sort of over here outside of the stream of the whole of community system response so our efforts including at our meeting on Thursday for the strategy and accountability table will include bringing this work through that whole of community system response where as this report indicates as this response changes evolves expands learns we will need to make sure we’re vetting proposals ideas requests through that table so there is broader discussion there are representatives at that table from BIA’s from the development community from social service delivery communities from a number of organizations including health care institutions those conversations will happen there and then what we will bring forward to you for consideration and discussion will be something that has been discussed and debated as part of that system response so that you uh can at least be reassured it’s tied to that system it’ll fall under those values and principles that you’ve endorsed already uh and that will include multiple voices beyond just those that are trying to make an immediate impact thank you Mr Dickens before i go to the counselor i have Councillor Stevenson, Councillor ramen, and Mayor Morgan on the list I just wanted to confirm that Councillors should feel comfortable coming to this i know i know comments have been made before about the need for Councillors to um we don’t have to show up in disguise i mean it’s okay for us to come but but i i know the comments were made before about the the the importance of Councillors may be stepping back uh a bit but i i see these meetings especially the ones that are close to us as our opportunity to sort of get a little more hands on do i have that right uh mr Livingston yes that is exactly right we would very much like counsel to be uh members to be at those meetings if they are able we would like you to hear from the public firsthand see the questions the purpose of these sessions are twofold to provide education and awareness for as we’ve just heard this evening people don’t necessarily understand the plan particularly well so they can come and ask questions and talk to folks about that and then also provide their input on locations being neighbors all of those components and we would try and answer as many of their questions as they’re raising or be able to take that comment and feedback to the various tables that are doing their work so we see this as a really important opportunity and as i said we will be doing the same through the business reference table with the business community as well of course they’re welcome to come to these sessions also uh and so i would really be very happy if council members came so you could hear it firsthand as we’re trying to engage the community and these initial discussions about this piece and there will be other engagements as we continue to move forward with the pieces of work thank you miss Livingston um and before i go to the next speaker i do want to remind everyone that we um i don’t know if we if you have a councilor Stevenson has a seconder for her amendment but we have not moved or seconded the original motion counselor ramen thank you i’ll move the original motion please okay i have a mover do i have a seconder for that motion counselor purple so motion is moved and seconded and next on the list uh i believe counselor Stevenson thank you i have a few general questions as we get more into the specifics i have several questions but in deputy the deputy mayor said something about he heard there was going to be a public participation meeting on the encampments coming up can i please confirm if that’s true mr. Dickens uh that was not shared by staff no that’s not that was not part of this plan thank you counselor can yeah i i’d like to request through the chair um from the city manager why there won’t be a public participation meeting on the encampment strategy thank you counselor miss Livingston certainly mr. chair uh it’s council’s decision on whether you wish to have a ppm on these pieces of work the approach that we’re taking to engage the community uh in the work right now is through these public engagement sessions through standing up the business reference table the development reference table uh through the online survey that is how we’re engaging uh right now in order to inform uh have the hub table be as informed as possible by community input in the development of the implementation plan for the first five hubs that would be brought forward to council on july 19th we are not recommending a ppm if council wishes us to proceed with one that’s of course at your direction part of the reason why we are front-end loading the engagement is so that the plan can be informed you would see all of that input but we are also very mindful of the time and so we’re trying to do things at the same time and to then hold a ppm pushes things out in additional month when we’re trying to move forward with standing hubs up before the end of the year so we front-end loaded the engagement tried to do many many different ways and opportunities so that council would have all of that information have you part of those meetings and then see all of that come together as a plan that’s what we’ve been moving forward with in order to get something in front of you in a timely way thank you miss livingston uh counselor stevenson thank you and i understand about the delays that part’s already been made but the public participation meeting seems to be the thing where the public gets to say we’re doing i don’t understand why staff is recommending one on fireworks and not on something as basic as the encampment response where everything in this says that we’re working towards a fulsome encampment response and the people are not getting to have their normal method to say and i understanding that if council requests it which i’ve already done um but i’m wondering why staff isn’t recommending that without slowing anything down thank you counselor stevenson i believe miss livingston spoke to that already but if she would like to speak to it again i can have miss livingston so miss livingston i when there’s a bylaw there’s a requirement for us to undertake a ppm so that is the difference between uh perhaps the fire bylaw example and what we’re what we are doing here so however what i would like to just reiterate is we take the importance of engaging the community in this work quite seriously which is why we are undertaking these community meetings the get involved site the engagement of the business community engagement of the development community in as many ways as we can in a timely way to inform the implementation plan so that council has all of that information in order to make a decision thank you miss livingston uh counselor stevenson thank you and um i really struggle with this we talk about building a bridge as we cross it and yet there are many in the public who feel like we don’t even know where the bridge is going and to just be left in the dark are we being asked to walk in faith or just completely blind and i i’d also like clarity um the city manager just said we were more than welcome and i’m assuming that was at these hub things we’re not talking about at any of the tables or anything to do with the health and homelessness or any of the counselors allowed to attend any of those thank you counselor stevenson i’ll let miss livingston answer that and then i will go to the next person on the speaker’s list miss livingston uh through you mr chair as i believe i’ve tried to address uh at other meetings uh i respect absolutely the desire of counsel to be actively engaged in this work and uh we have tried to find many avenues for that to happen we are providing monthly reports we are asking you to be engaged in the uh community consultations uh we are bringing every decision forward on uh on the plan this is uh this is something that is happening alongside it but it is coming here when it comes to the implementation tables uh and sorry i just want to be clear we’ve also been clear in the report that the ultimate oversight of how this gets delivered is with counsel in terms of funding uh decisions on by-law changes policy changes uh where uh where things can be located or not located all of that is within council oversight where we have asked that um the community be uh given the time and opportunity to do their work is at the implementation tables so i would still make that request i can’t enforce it with you i’m respectfully asking the work is challenging it is work in progress uh and but those products come here for decision-making thank you miss livingston thank you counselor i can put you back on the list uh at the bottom of the list but next i have counselor ramen the counselor ramen has said that uh the mayor can go first so i’ll switch it around ma’am organ you’re next on the list yes thank you um so i i’ll make it just a couple quick comments um on the general um the general strategy first off like i i guess i want colleagues to understand that like and i and i think everybody does this is like this is an imperfect um this is an imperfect problem with what’s going to have an imperfect uh response to it um in talking with with mayors across the province like there are a number of municipalities grappling with encampments in a number of different ways there are legal and court cases associated with them uh there are uh those who have carved out some some best practices those who have found things that really don’t work and what i see mr dickens and his team doing here are are incorporating a whole bunch of those learnings into this short 30 60 90 day strategy to try to make the biggest possible impact uh for the resources that we have available uh as an in-term uh step to try to get us through the summer which we know is going to be a very difficult time we will not be ramping up the types of long-term system changes that we need in time to deal with the summer obviously that’s very clear we need to deal with encampments we need to navigate the challenges that come with them we we need to uh navigate the the legal discussions that are happening with encampments we have to deal with the human rights uh discussions that are happening within encampments and i think what what what has been carved out here is something that is is is reflective of those conversations as they have evolved in other cities and and trying to incorporate something that will work here for us in the short term so like i know there’s some conversation about the health and homelessness work happening here but the focus of this particular report is we have like a short-term challenge that we need to tackle like right now not a month from now not two months from now but like a short-term challenge that we need to like put some resources behind and try to make better and then evolve that as it goes on and maybe we’ll do some things right or we’ll do some things wrong and then we’ll have those learnings that we can share and we’ll have with other municipalities as well as incorporate into the work that the longer-term strategy will develop so this will be very difficult for us to navigate because it’s not going to go smooth things the status quo is not smooth here or in many other cities you know this is a this is a crisis that we’ve not seen um in you know advanced democratic nations to the level that we we’ve seen it and and so like we’re we’re working on something you know as we go and and and what i see before us is some best practices cobbled into a short term approach that i think you know will will for the most part help us stop the gap as we try to get to the next phase and the next step in the longer term solution the next step towards the longer term solution i should say so you know i appreciate the discussion i also appreciate the frustration and um and uh you know angst in in many of my colleagues voices i and i know what people are saying in the community because i hear it too um and we’re not going to have great answers for those questions that people are asking because there aren’t great answers to solving this challenge across the country right now so we have to take these emergency in term steps to try to get us to the next step we have to do the next best thing that we can possibly do based on that what we know today monday morning quarterbacking every step of this along the way isn’t going to get us to the next best step because this challenge isn’t going to go away by us continuing to analyze what happened yesterday or the day before this challenge is going to go away by just taking those learnings and applying them to the next step in the process so um i’ll be supportive of of the intern steps um that are contemplated in the report um i look forward to hearing from uh colleagues about their their thoughts and discussions but i i i want to say i i hear your frustration and i and i feel it and i and i i know that it’s tough to grapple with but it is a challenge that we have to work on together as a council and it’s it’s going to be something that is not going to get easier in in the next few months but hopefully the plan that is outlined here will help make it a little bit easier for us to get to the next step it’s certainly easier for those who are suffering on their streets where as the deputy mayor said by offering some some some best practices and some solutions to give people some dignity and offer them some relief from what will be i think a difficult and challenging summer thank you mr mayor um next on the speakers list counselor ramen thank you and through you um i want to thank the mayor for his comments um i think that uh you know it’s it’s important that we hear from leaders on on these issues and hear that yes there there isn’t that perfect solution that that solves it for everybody but that right now there is this need for um for the community to feel like uh we’re doing the best we can to address the basic health and and and care needs of people that are right now living in encampments and when we when we’re talking about encampments we’re talking about a shelter that you know is is their temporary shelter because we don’t have the appropriate ways to shelter them right now um so uh it is incumbent on us to do what we can and i think what’s in front of us right now is the opportunity to to offer those safe stopgap measures and if we weren’t offering those what’s the alternative that’s that’s out there i mean if any other service like what is it that we could be doing other than this that would be helping to address basic needs um i think what’s in front of us does that if it was to go to another service you know i’m seeing in other cities what i will call you know unfortunate uh reactions to encampments right now and that that’s policing costs and so you know we have two members of our police service board here uh is that what they’re is that i know mayor morgan has stated where he isn’t this but i’m saying like the alternative uh what is it because if it’s additional costs of another service then we’re swapping one for the other and one gives people food dignity water and and provides them with care where they are right now and the other is unkind and and and humane so i i’ll leave it at that but um i will as i mentioned be supporting this motion in front of us thank you counselor ramen i have counselor pribble counselor stevenson and the deputy mayor next on the list so counselor pribble so to chair to the staff i know at last meeting i ask for the proposed initiatives because i didn’t believe it’s going to get us from march 31st to the first uh to the first initiatives coming up from the summit uh i was told that the 30-60-90 day encampment strategic team is going to come up with certain initiatives which are hopefully going to get us through which we did and i thank you to the staff and i think to the uh encampment strategy team as well so we do have that and i believe that i believe that is going to alleviate the pressure and it’s going to get us through so there’s no doubt and as i said right from the beginning we need to do that there is no doubt uh going back to the six weeks because there was a comment made by mr.

Dickens that we are trying to get into the initiatives of the summit uh coming out of the summit uh unless the dates have changed the earliest would have been beginning or during the fall of this year this will take us till the end of july are you are they’re going to be certain initiatives introduced earlier and if not uh can we start talking about thinking already now because again these agencies that are going to provide these services potentially they are going to hire another one two persons and potentially in six weeks when this runs out that one two persons hired they won’t have the commitment of work and they are going to leave somewhere else does it make sense already now to talk about longer period of time so these agencies can make certain commitments to the staff thank you thank you counselor mr. Dickens uh thank you chair and through you um as i touched on at the beginning of this uh report there were many ideas that came forward from the working group and then like it feels like we’re moving at the speed of light with some of this with the urgency but there are there are many ideas that came forward um proposals additional staffing longer term bigger budgets more resources different locations and where we felt we were most comfortable right now was trying to balance getting everything in place right away with what can we reasonably deliver on right now and then continue to try and refine and evaluate and get better at what are those resources that we need to have in place and be laser sharp on our focus about what it is we’re asking for so if we’re asking for money exactly how much money for what purpose for what resource for how long so while we had gathered a lot of ideas proposals budgets some of it did stretch well past the summer and we could have brought that forward in this report but we did not think that would be appropriate at this time for this committee that we should try to do this in a bit of a manageable or coordinated way knowing that that that is risking some of those possibilities as the group starts to refine and become more clear on what those additional phases of those response would look like be it additional service hubs expanded hours additional staff somebody to coordinate a lot of this so it’s not off the side of everyone’s desk those type of things so that is the work that we will start to funnel through the whole of community system response to that strategy and accountability table so that’s where those conversations around what are we doing in phase two how many people how many spaces let’s let’s approach those conversations through our model and through our system delivery what i would like to just clarify as well is that we have multiple simultaneous initiatives planning sessions happening in unison so we have a hubs implementation table that is working to try and land a very comprehensive and detailed hubs plan for sppc in july that work of the hubs table is being informed by the online surveys the five in person sessions be standing up of a business table so the business community provides direct input on the hubs plan on the developers side but as well as individuals with lived and living experience so that they are too designing and providing input on what the hubs plan should look like at the same time as running the business table the developers table the strategy and accountability table the hubs table we’ve also uh tomorrow will be our second highly supportive housing table where we’re trying to look at clearly defining the work of highly supportive housing getting a hundred units online this year ensuring we have those uh those foundational pieces so people have a place to be housed with the right types of support in addition to that we were also on check getting exhausted talking about it in addition to that we’re also launching our workforce development table this month which will help sort of craft a current state of the environment when it comes to staff skills abilities and capacity and delivering service and also mapping out a bit of a strategy on how we grow a workforce with what type of workforce and how that workforce could work together so all of those initiatives are happening right now the encampment report before you is a singular response right now that will evolve and change we will make sure we bring any additional measures to you before there before there’s any implementation and what we will look to a broader community engagement on will be a community encampment strategy this is simply an acute health and safety response a community strategy would follow multiple channels of engagement consultation and input including and fundamentally those that are current currently experiencing homelessness thank you mr. Dickens counselor just glad to hear all these initiatives sent uh actions are in place the only question i actually had if we don’t have if any one of these we know that they’re not going to be in place in august and the first true initiatives will be placed in the fall that was the only thing is why i was saying why don’t we make it a decision now and why do we come back thank you counselor uh mr. Dickens um i may need some clarity on this through you chair so what we’re indicating here is that these are the first six weeks like we’ll start as soon as we can as soon as we have council approval to draw down on the reserve fund we’ll be putting in place you know maintaining those service hours for CIR and expanding garbage collection as soon as we can get approval to modify these contracts we’ll be expanding the spaces and the services like this stuff is happening right away as soon as we can it will run for the first six weeks because we’re looking at like a 30-day window how do we get things up and running right now in the first 30 days immediately we’re we’re continuously i should say we’re still trying to define and refine what the next six weeks will look like and that’s where we want to tie that work to the community tables through the uh community system response so these items here will run for six weeks absolutely because that’s where we felt we were able to bring you right now instead of bringing you a fully baked fully detailed here’s the next 90 days that take us into the end of September we weren’t prepared to do that at this point ideally would have been awesome to do that would have been great but we need to we need to step this so that we are calculated and we have all the information at our fingertips to bring to you to the best of our ability thank you mr.

Dickens uh counselor dribble just i’m just going to make a comment now thank you again for all the all the answers as soon as we know that we are not going to come up anything better for august if we could wait not like let’s say when we talked about last we talked about two weeks when the program was finished and then the agencies are struggling so as soon as we know that we cannot come up with anything better if we can start addressing as the agencies and make a commitment till we see the light at the end of the tunnel which the summit is going to bring us that’s what i was trying to say thank you thank you counselor dribble i have counselor Stevenson and then deputy mayor lewis next on the list so counselor Stevenson thank you i think my frustration around all this is pretty evident um when this health and homelessness response was talked about we talked about a hundred transitional home or transitional or support highly supportive housing and the five hubs and now we have an encampment strategy coming we’ve got service depots and urban depots i am not sure how we got to the place where encampments are okay and where we are now going to provide three meals a day snacks bottled water which cannot be good for our climate emergency action plan 3,840 bottles a week i don’t know how we got here and i don’t support this and i’m very concerned about the service depots and the urban depots and where they’re going to go the women shelter went on to danda street and i let that happen i was told it was only going to be four months things are not just going to keep happening in ward four people get to have a say they elected me for a reason because i said that i could do something that i would support them in what is needed the despair and the hopelessness is not only in those encampments there is such despair and hopelessness in old east village it’s it the emails would make people cry if they read them where is the support for those people where is the safety and security and the health and the mental health and the support there isn’t even a phone number for them to call who do they call in the middle of the night some of them are sleeping in their living room because they’re so scared that people are going to be breaking into their homes because they’re on the porches and in the backyard they’re taking everything that isn’t pinned down people are scared and we are focused on bringing meals and water to encampments what about the rest of the people they want help for these other people too but they don’t want meals in encampments by the river they want what we promised them decent affordable housing health care addiction treatment this um this is a lot of money for six weeks we went from hearing we’re so glad we’re going to be done with a temporary winter response we’re moving towards something more permanent and now we’re in a six-week temporary summer response somehow we were okay leaving people in april in the rain and the snow without a winter response and without a summer response we were okay with that we were okay with it in may and now all of a sudden in june it’s not okay now we need a temporary summer response is governing this who is saying that this is what we what we want is it what londoners want and maybe some of the other counselors don’t have the literal pain and despair in their ward but in ward four and in that area around the social service agencies and the hub at adlating queens it is desperate times for people and that gets to be part of this this health and homeless and this whole of community it sounds really good but i’m telling you that the people in my ward do not feel like they are a part of that they do not hear that their city is committed to their well-being to their safety there are so many people who don’t have three meals a day they’re on odsp and we just go oh well it’s the province but here we’re going to bring three meals a day and snacks to the encampments counselor 30 seconds i will not be supporting this thank you counselor uh next on the list i have deputy mayor lewis thank you so colleagues i think we’ve gone around uh this issue quite a bit uh through this meeting uh i hope that uh the committee’s ready to have a vote on on this and i think that what we have to focus on are two things uh the first is that i think we need to focus on the immediacy right now and that’s what’s before us in in this recommendation from staff um but i do think that uh we cannot ignore uh the frustration in the community either um and when we talk about engaging with the public what i would encourage folks to do is for us to to deal with this matter tonight and at council but let’s all give some thought and let’s let’s actually take the opportunity this week to attend these meetings uh around the hubs um i’ve said this on other issues uh including the strategic plan and including the budget um inviting people here to sit up in the gallery not that you’re not welcome folks uh because you are um but inviting people here to sit up in the gallery uh well we debate and talk and then while they wait for their five minutes to talk that’s a formal ppm and and that’s not always the most effective way for people to have their voices heard so i hope we can deal with them item that’s before us but i i would encourage all of us to listen to what we’ve heard and not just from counselor stevenson i know i personally heard some of the same frustrations from jenn pestaurus and the oev last week uh i sat down with jenn to talk about cip’s but we also talked about the realities uh the businesses on the street are facing there so let’s take what we’ve heard tonight and give it some careful thought and think about what we want that public engagement around the longer term encampment strategy that mr dickens referenced earlier um and i apologize i when i heard public engagement i defaulted to ppm and that’s not necessarily uh the best most effective tool um so let’s think about what we want that public engagement to look like maybe we want to use the same strategy that we’re using on the hubs this week and next week where residents can come not to city hall and and sit up in what i’ve come to call the penalty box because it looks like we’re in a hockey arena now um but not so that they can sit up there but so that they can sit on the same level as us in community centers in libraries in wherever we’re going to hold these things and have some discussions and and let’s do that perhaps with staff present and with counselors present as well maybe that’s not what we go away from after we attend the meetings this week and decide it’s the best engagement tool either um i think that that there’s a desire for the public to have an opportunity to weigh in um is a valid one but i don’t think we need to decide tonight what exactly that has to look like because we are going to have longer range and reports coming in from the whole of community response i know that there’s an update at sppc there will continue to be reports coming to this committee as well and to mr dickens point as these things merge together um maybe we need to merge some of our public engagement processes as well maybe we need to stop being married to the idea of the gallery is the only place where we can hear from the public or a letter on the agenda is the only place we can hear from the public and let’s think about as we continue to deal with these problems once we have the hub engagements done um what do we want the next phase of and the next check-in for the public on this whole of community response as the encampment pieces are merged in as other pieces are merged in what does that public engagement look like coming forward i think we’ve got a real opportunity to to learn this week as we attend some of these meetings but i think it it’s actually not the best idea for us to make a snap decision on what that needs to look like right now because i think we do need to learn from those let’s see how they go this is the first time we’ve done something like this so let’s see if it’s productive or not and let’s reserve our judgment on on how we engage moving forward until after we’ve tried this and see if it works if it works great maybe this is the model we take forward if it doesn’t work maybe we’ve got another discussion amongst ourselves about what will work but i think what’s important right now is that we get to a decision point on this response um and uh get this agenda dispensed with tonight and continue the discussions with each other with the public with our staff because whether we support or oppose the motion that’s before us tonight the work’s a long way from done thank you deputy mayor i have counselor frank and then counselor ramen so counselor frank thank you and thanks for having me at your committee i now you can see i’ve joined virtually um i want to thank the staff for continuing to put forward a lot of effort um and a lot of consideration for this work um considering that you have the direct relationships with community members um and the expertise i think that while i share the passion of counselor stevenson that i’d like everyone to have a roof over their head and um a proper house i understand that you are working really hard to to try and meet the needs of people where they’re at um i would love to see us continue to use any and all tool we have that would be able to get people into housing um so i am excited to see how counselors react to um the motion that i put forward at pack and will be coming to council on june 27th to uh deeply uh or connect with developers and try to get 10% um affordable units in their developments because if we’re serious about trying to ensure that we’ve affordable housing for everyone we need to be looking at all options um and so i i look forward to seeing where counselors land on that because i will be bringing that back up um and i continue to applaud the work again of staff for for putting all this effort in i know it’s really hard and you’re having lots of discussions with people um but i thank you for the work that you’re doing and um keep it up thank you counselor frank i have counselor ramen so counselor thank you and uh thank you presiding officer for allowing me to speak uh on this matter again um i just want to go back before we vote on this matter and go to schedule one which is included in the report that outlines the funding requests that we’re receiving um that we’re improving through this motion because sometimes when we’re looking at emotion we get lost as to what that purpose of the motion is so that we’re all very very clear and intentional on what we are voting on so line one food and food safety up to forty two thousand dollars for food and food safety going further down that list you know we’ve got up to five thousand dollars for hygiene and sanitation services uh go up that list we’re talking about some of those supports that we’re saying help address how people’s mental health and and how they’re feeling the up to sixty five thousand to be uh accommodating within existing um social uh in health development services through those existing drop-in in staff supports again to the hygiene and sanitation services security for showers we’re talking about seven thousand dollars so when we’re talking about voting no or voting yes on this matter this is what we’re talking about we’re talking about things that hit basic human needs basic human rights so again as we vote right now on this matter i’m mindful of what it is i’m voting on i’m mindful of what the costs are and i’m mindful about what the implications are when you don’t vote to support these things thank you thank you counsel robin that exhaust the speaker’s list so i’m gonna ask once if there’s anybody councilor Stevenson thank you i’d just like to say to that point that to remember that these people are living in an encampment by the river there is nothing kind safe humane about that and bringing them three meals a day in a shower does not change that in my opinion it’s a very very unsafe place to be um when it comes to the hubs in the community involvement i would like to say that there is nothing centrally located we’ve got the can it can it aquatic we’ve got the quanist and we’re way out at east lions community center there’s nothing central is there okay is that changed i said to miss Livingston thank you mr chair for allowing me to answer yes june 26 at kawana’s community center which is in black friars area so central to the central so we tried to put in all geography so it’s central we’re using facilities we have uh thank you miss livingston um usually there’s something at the central library or maybe carling optimum center i mean for my ward they’ve got to go quite a bit west or quite a bit east i just wondered if if it was possible to add another one in that might be a little more central thank you and through the chair we looked at community centers we were in a short period of time so i looked at community centers where i didn’t have to cancel programming i understand what you said carling heights i would have chosen that however it’s closed for renovations and maintenance and repairs and painting so this was the closest one that didn’t have um any uh events or activities that we had to cancel in the evening so in in the future we would pick uh carling heights if it was open any chance of using the central library miss lemme mister chair am i being asked to hold a second one in the we’ve already advertised this one the date and the place or if is council asking us to undertake a second one at the library uh this debate has uh been going on forbidden it was a good debate so i will go back to council stephen sent us that question and then i will ask miss living sent to answer the question then we’ll call the question thank you i’m not going to make that request i will reach out and send out the uh survey myself and i think it’s a it matters it really does matter and i think if we have to hold it on a street corner in a parking lot people should be given the opportunity to be able to speak a lot of people a lot of seniors are not going to use the survey the app or the link i’m not going to be able to get that information to them and it’s it’s a long way to travel to kwanis or out to east lions and there was only a week’s notice so i do think there are ways that we are able to serve people in a better way on something that matters so incredibly much right and in the area that is the most impacted is the area that does not has not been served so i’m not asking for it but i am saying that going forward in future the area that is the most impacted gets to be made a priority because they’re really not feeling like they’re a priority and i heard that all last summer when i was canvassing and i didn’t really believe it and i am seeing it now and it’s unfair and it doesn’t i understand it’s inconvenient they have a right they have rights to thank you counselor that exhaustive speakers list so i’ll be calling the question councilor sevinson i vote no closing the vote the motion carries four to one okay thank you that moves us on to the next item for direction and that is item 4.4 a communication from counselor pribble on the winter response so i will go to counselor pribble thank you answer the church staff this is the thing we talked about last meeting last meeting and there was the request and i’m looking for last four years and i think the motion has been updated now with those four years as well and again just repeating myself since the last meeting whatever like to we had two different strategies internal external and i would like the comparison to see i do believe you are going to have a great system coming out of the summit but i do want to know if certain things are not working out we should as a proper corporation we had two different approaches to solve this matter during the last four years and we should know how each one was efficient what were the strength weaknesses so just in case we need to jump back into it so we know which one was the better one thank you i will go to mr. Dickens um thank you chair and through you just a point of clarification it would be three years not four years of winter response i just want to make sure that’s clear thank you and counselor pribble you have more to say no just to fall up i wasn’t sure if it was three or four three perfect thank you thank you counselor pribble so you are moving this and i’m looking for a second sorry i’m removing that there needs to be an update from the clerk to three years and then i’m moving it okay we’ll wait for that update it’s done okay check your e-scribe just if that year one of the fourth year the it could be deleted as well not just the words three to four but also the the year in the bracket if it could be deleted please also for which year would you like to delete question to the staff mr. Dickens sort of 1920 wasn’t correct or 1920 didn’t happen correct through the chair that is correct so we’re looking at a um 2020 21 21 22 22 23 would be the three years i will just if i may chair um the wording i just want to make sure um is it at the next caps meeting that this is requested this report counselor during the last meeting i was told that this would be able we will be able to do this by end of july mr. Dickens correct that was in may and it never manifested so as we’re now a month later in june my team is going to be dedicated to bringing you a hub’s plan in july and a number of other initiatives related to community engagement and consultations i would be pulling people off of that work to do this if we could if if committee was amenable to it if we could get back to you in august that would give us some breathing room mr.

Dickens counselor purple yes i just think that by end of august is sorry by the meeting in august that would be fine thank you i’m looking for a seconder counselor stevenson and i will ask for any speakers on the speakers list to speak to this no speakers i will call the question closing the vote the motion carries four to one okay that is the last of the public session oh sorry we have uh section five deferred matters additional business five point one i’m looking for a mover and seconder to receive that uh deferred matters list so robin moving counselor stevenson seconding okay looking for speakers list speakers okay call the question closing the vote the motion carries five to zero okay and counselor stevenson is just informing that she has something for additional business so counselor stevenson thank you and i don’t know if i have a seconder but i’m going to ask for one i’d like to put forward a motion that dates that none of the first five hubs will be in the core area do i have a seconder for that thing to committee for a seconder for counselor stevenson’s motion also purple i’m not planning to second it right now or i’m not but uh i will wait i see what the counselor and i i know what she means and she means well and i would agree with her but i’m gonna first wait for the report from the staff and then if i feel that there are no better proposed sites then i think we can come back to it thank you thank you and i’ll speak to the chair um from what i understand is negotiations or um a review of where encampments are going to be and where encampments are not going to be and it’s happening right now so maybe i should go to mr dickens if you’d like to speak to that mr dickens uh thank you chair through you so as we outlined in the note to counsel uh the invite uh through counsel uh the online information page is we are asking the business community individuals of lived experience the general community neighborhood associations um to provide us criteria for which they think is important about where hubs are located so to your assumption yes that is correct that work is happening in real time to inform the plan what the plan will produce is a community informed through many different voices uh some criteria but where hubs should be located it will not come back and say the first hub is going here they’ll say this is a criteria we should be using when it comes time to select where the hubs will go that will also make up part of the expression of interest to look for lead agencies to say you must follow this plan as it’s been endorsed whatever that looks like by counsel that these are the criteria you use for where they go and where they don’t go and then all of the service standards and the like so i think that work will happen uh down the road thank you mr dickens and i’ll just ask from the chair as well if you can look into your crystal ball and maybe tell us a time frame of when we might be expecting that as mentioned chair that comes to the july sppc which is why we’re moving so quickly thank you i miss that thank you mr dickens um counsel stevens thank you and i’d just like to remind too that there was a council approved poor area action plan number 69 that said there was a perceived over saturation of social services in the core that there was to be a mapping uh an investigation as to whether um that was necessary and if so how to manage that and that is a necessary part of this i’m hoping it’s part of what this process is but that was already a council approved thing that was not done thank you counselor stevenson um okay we will move on to the confidential items uh so i will look for a mover to move us into in-camera counselor ramen seconder counselor stevenson hand vote okay let’s do a physical vote as per the clerk closing the vote the motion carries five to zero to everyone online uh who is going to be in this in-camera session the clerk has asked for a few moments to just set up recording in progress okay we are back in public session i will look to counselor ramen to report out uh of our in-camera session counselor ramen thank you and through you presiding officer i’m happy to report the progress was made on item 6.1 and 6.2 thank you counselor ramen and that is everything on the agenda so i’m looking for a motion to adjourn counselor ramen seconded by deputy mayor i don’t know if you can second this one seconded by student c or counselor stevenson all in favor to adjourn that motion is carried